Randy Moss

[jason]

WR Should defintely be our #1 priority next offseason in the draft. Especially if we end up picking in the teens or god forbid the top 10. I'm so sick and tired of watching this same group of WR's every year, it's time for some fresh blood. If we can get a potential #1 WR in the draft this year, we have to go for it with no questions asked. What our offense lacks is weapons. I mean, legit weapons. It's been an absolute crime what we've made Jay Cutler work with in this offense. You look at just about every single team in the league and you can pin point one or two guys that you really have to worry about on the offensive side of the ball in the passing game. Is anyone really scared of Devin Hester catching 90 balls are going over 1000 yards in a season? How about Johnny Knox? Roy Williams? He hasn't done it since 06. You see where I'm getting at? Hester and Knox are both big play threats because of their speed but it only happens in spurts throughout a season. If we can get our hands on a #1 receiver he not only makes our offense better, but he makes Jay Cutler better and Vice Versa.

 

Completely disagree. OL still has to outweigh WR. Imagine if this team had Calvin Johnson, Wes Welker, and Hines Ward, a perfect combo of #1, slot, and chain-mover. It wouldn't freaking matter that much because 2 of the first 3 games have seen Cutler get his ass pounded like a 112lb fresh prison fish. Would he have torched the Packers? Yes. So have other teams. Hell, I'm not sure he would have had much more than the 300+ he already had. Maybe 350-400? That would have been cool and all, but he still would have taken a beating and the WRs would have not lived up to the potential they currently have.

 

Getting a #1 like Calvin Johson would be great, but with this OL the talent would be severely undercut.

[jason]

To add fuel to the Randy Moss fire, is there even a question that he's better than anyone on the Bears' roster?! Seriously?

 

Compare him to the "big" #1 signing of Roy Williams, for instance.

 

Roy Williams

08 - 36, 440, 2TDs (multiple teams)

09 - 38, 591, 7TDs

10 - 37, 530, 5TDs

 

Randy Moss

08 - 69, 1008, 11TDs

09 - 83, 1264, 13TDs

10 - 28, 393, 5TDs (multiple teams)

 

I'm sorry, I just don't buy the "Randy Moss is old" argument. Dude got completely ignored while with the Titans for the second half of the 2010 season; that is undebatable. And I didn't both to include 2007, because that would have been a ridiculous comparison since Moss put up 23 TDs. And if he did get old, then his old is better than Roy Williams is currently.

 

Did he get shorter since? No.

Did he get incredibly slower? No.

Did he forget how to get open? No.

Did he misplace his jumping ability? No

Did he suddenly lose the ability to catch? No.

 

Hence, he's better than any WR the Bears have right now. And he should be approached, at the very least. (something I've wanted for several years)

 

 

[flea]

Just a point but how bad would the OL be in a non Martz Offense? It doesn't really help them as you could have 5 probowlers there & Cutler would still take a pounding it's the nature of the O. No?

[Bears4Ever_34]

Completely disagree. OL still has to outweigh WR. Imagine if this team had Calvin Johnson, Wes Welker, and Hines Ward, a perfect combo of #1, slot, and chain-mover. It wouldn't freaking matter that much because 2 of the first 3 games have seen Cutler get his ass pounded like a 112lb fresh prison fish. Would he have torched the Packers? Yes. So have other teams. Hell, I'm not sure he would have had much more than the 300+ he already had. Maybe 350-400? That would have been cool and all, but he still would have taken a beating and the WRs would have not lived up to the potential they currently have.

 

Getting a #1 like Calvin Johson would be great, but with this OL the talent would be severely undercut.

We need more skill position players period. Besides this tackle class is not very deep this year, do you really want another Chris Williams? At the end of the day, drafting lineman are not going to help us score more points and become a more explosive offense, but WR's would. The greatest trait in a WR is the ability to separate. Right now not a single one of our receivers have that ability and it won't change unless we put more emphasis on the WR position in the draft that's not from a Div II school. I don't think people really understand just how important it is to have a great WR. Do you see how easy it is for Matt Stafford in the redzone? Hell all he has to do is flip it up there and watch Calvin Johnson come down with it. Cutler had that guy in Denver, and now he needs it again.

[madlithuanian]

So much banks on who's drafting...

 

My contention for next draft is that 2 of the 1st 3 picks be OL. If the star is WR in the first, and the OL guys don't grade as well, you go WR. If it's OL, OL , WR...good there too. Whichever slot has the correct grade and fit.

 

There are outstanding OL found in the 2nd and 3rd rounds all the time. Just not by us... We need a better drafter.

 

Completely disagree. OL still has to outweigh WR. Imagine if this team had Calvin Johnson, Wes Welker, and Hines Ward, a perfect combo of #1, slot, and chain-mover. It wouldn't freaking matter that much because 2 of the first 3 games have seen Cutler get his ass pounded like a 112lb fresh prison fish. Would he have torched the Packers? Yes. So have other teams. Hell, I'm not sure he would have had much more than the 300+ he already had. Maybe 350-400? That would have been cool and all, but he still would have taken a beating and the WRs would have not lived up to the potential they currently have.

 

Getting a #1 like Calvin Johson would be great, but with this OL the talent would be severely undercut.

 

[madlithuanian]

Let me fan the flames...

 

To me it a no brainer. Then again, our GM has no brain...

 

To add fuel to the Randy Moss fire, is there even a question that he's better than anyone on the Bears' roster?! Seriously?

 

Compare him to the "big" #1 signing of Roy Williams, for instance.

 

Roy Williams

08 - 36, 440, 2TDs (multiple teams)

09 - 38, 591, 7TDs

10 - 37, 530, 5TDs

 

Randy Moss

08 - 69, 1008, 11TDs

09 - 83, 1264, 13TDs

10 - 28, 393, 5TDs (multiple teams)

 

I'm sorry, I just don't buy the "Randy Moss is old" argument. Dude got completely ignored while with the Titans for the second half of the 2010 season; that is undebatable. And I didn't both to include 2007, because that would have been a ridiculous comparison since Moss put up 23 TDs. And if he did get old, then his old is better than Roy Williams is currently.

 

Did he get shorter since? No.

Did he get incredibly slower? No.

Did he forget how to get open? No.

Did he misplace his jumping ability? No

Did he suddenly lose the ability to catch? No.

 

Hence, he's better than any WR the Bears have right now. And he should be approached, at the very least. (something I've wanted for several years)

 

[madlithuanian]

Less bad. How much so, I'm not sure. But I would think a better OC would utilize pluses and minimize negatives.

 

Just a point but how bad would the OL be in a non Martz Offense? It doesn't really help them as you could have 5 probowlers there & Cutler would still take a pounding it's the nature of the O. No?

 

[nfoligno]

Age old arguement, but I still side on the OL.

 

Would a stud WR help. Of course. If you had a stud who could get open fast, theoretically the OL doesn't have to hold their blocks as long and Cutler has a quicker option.

 

At the same time, I would argue upgrading the OL would do more to help the offense than a stud WR

 

1. We saw this past week. GB dropped most into coverage, and didn't even blitz much. Doing this, you would think we could run the ball. Not only could we not run, we were getting hit in the backfield on most downs. If you had a stud WR, this would not change as the defense already had most men in coverage. The only way to improve the run game is to improve the OL.

 

2. Continued off point 1. If you improve the run game, you improve the passing game. No, we don't have great WRs. At the same time, our run blocking is so bad that a defense can play nickel all day w/o fear of the run. If you improve the OL, and thus your run game, you force defenses to take men out of coverage, thus giving Cutler and the WRs more room to work.

 

3. Improve the OL, and you improve the time Cutler has to work. Do our WRs get quick separation? Nope. But given time, they get open and Cutler can hit his targets. Currently, Cutler either has no time, or he has time but so many in coverage they strangle the WRs. Improve the OL, thus balance, and Cutler should have more time while also having fewer DBs to deal with.

 

I realize a stud WR would help, but IMHO, upgrading the OL does more for the offense than adding a stud WR.

 

We need more skill position players period. Besides this tackle class is not very deep this year, do you really want another Chris Williams? At the end of the day, drafting lineman are not going to help us score more points and become a more explosive offense, but WR's would. The greatest trait in a WR is the ability to separate. Right now not a single one of our receivers have that ability and it won't change unless we put more emphasis on the WR position in the draft that's not from a Div II school. I don't think people really understand just how important it is to have a great WR. Do you see how easy it is for Matt Stafford in the redzone? Hell all he has to do is flip it up there and watch Calvin Johnson come down with it. Cutler had that guy in Denver, and now he needs it again.

 

[jason]

We need more skill position players period. Besides this tackle class is not very deep this year, do you really want another Chris Williams? At the end of the day, drafting lineman are not going to help us score more points and become a more explosive offense, but WR's would. The greatest trait in a WR is the ability to separate. Right now not a single one of our receivers have that ability and it won't change unless we put more emphasis on the WR position in the draft that's not from a Div II school. I don't think people really understand just how important it is to have a great WR. Do you see how easy it is for Matt Stafford in the redzone? Hell all he has to do is flip it up there and watch Calvin Johnson come down with it. Cutler had that guy in Denver, and now he needs it again.

 

WHAT?! The bolded part is insanity. The two parts are symbiotic. I don't care if you pick up Calvin Johson, he doesn't do a damn thing in the New Orleans game. Period. Cutler would have thrown the same balls because the pressure would have been the exact same. You don't think the opposing defenses worry about Knox and Hester going deep? They have to at least roll some safety support. But when they know they can get to the QB in 1.3 seconds, that is how they will attack.

 

Put it this way:

 

Cutler + Forte + Bears WRs + Best OL in history (90s Cowboys) = Prolific offense

Cutler + Forte + Jerry Rice,Calvin Johson,Steve Largent + Bears OL = Average offense, at best (because of everything NFO said).

[madlithuanian]

I'm not really sure he's arguing against a stud OL. I think the arguement is based on what's there to be had. If the option is Anthony Munoz or Calvin Johnson, i think the Munoz picks is the one. But if the pick is Calvin Johnson or Chris Williams...then you go Calvin. Much will depend on where we are picking. Top picks no longer have the financial stigma they once did.

 

I also contend that some of the improvement on the OL must come from FA...something JA definitley $hit the bed on this off-season.

 

I see the only real keepers on this squad as Garza (who should return to guard) and Carimi. That means we need 3 spots filled. I think bring in a FA center, and draft a G and T. Or some combination of the sort.

 

 

 

 

Age old arguement, but I still side on the OL.

 

Would a stud WR help. Of course. If you had a stud who could get open fast, theoretically the OL doesn't have to hold their blocks as long and Cutler has a quicker option.

 

At the same time, I would argue upgrading the OL would do more to help the offense than a stud WR

 

1. We saw this past week. GB dropped most into coverage, and didn't even blitz much. Doing this, you would think we could run the ball. Not only could we not run, we were getting hit in the backfield on most downs. If you had a stud WR, this would not change as the defense already had most men in coverage. The only way to improve the run game is to improve the OL.

 

2. Continued off point 1. If you improve the run game, you improve the passing game. No, we don't have great WRs. At the same time, our run blocking is so bad that a defense can play nickel all day w/o fear of the run. If you improve the OL, and thus your run game, you force defenses to take men out of coverage, thus giving Cutler and the WRs more room to work.

 

3. Improve the OL, and you improve the time Cutler has to work. Do our WRs get quick separation? Nope. But given time, they get open and Cutler can hit his targets. Currently, Cutler either has no time, or he has time but so many in coverage they strangle the WRs. Improve the OL, thus balance, and Cutler should have more time while also having fewer DBs to deal with.

 

I realize a stud WR would help, but IMHO, upgrading the OL does more for the offense than adding a stud WR.

 

[nfoligno]

One. I don't have the article in front of me, but I do recall the hit/miss % highly favoring OL over WR. So a WR you are looking at in the first, who grades out higher, often is still the riskier pick than the OL. If we had a top 5 pick, and there was a Cavlin Johnson type talent, compared to a group of OL graded out no better than 15 range, that's one thing, but how often do you really see that?

 

Two. Frankly, I don't think Garza is all that. I think Garza looks good because of the total crap he is surrounded by, but on a good OL, he would be considered the weak link. For several years he was the favored whipping boy on the OL for many here, including myself. I still don't think he is that good. He just looks good compared to the rest. If we are talking about looking long term, and who on the OL should be part of the picture, I would not consider him. He may stick for now, but only until we can replace him.

 

Carimi obviously looks like a player we consider part of our future. I am up/down when it comes to Chris Williams, who is coming off his worst game, but previously had seemed solid. And I say that as a person he hated the idea of him at OG. But even in the last game, is it really wise to have your LG pull and hit one of the fastest blitzing OLBs on the other side? Mathews beats better OL who line up directly in front of him, yet we were asking Williams to run to the other side of the pocket and block him?

 

But the point is, I'd pencil in Williams and Carimin as part of my long term OL plan, and even those two are in pencil, not pen. That means we need a LT, C and RG, not to mention depth. We need a massive influx of talent across the OL.

 

But as long as Angelo is in charge, I expect little. He simply does not value the position. In the draft, he only takes one high when forced. Otherwise it's a position he takes chances on late, 6th or 7th rd. In FA, he simply doesn't value the position enough to be a player for the better FAs, so he looks for bargains. Even when the pan out, most are band-aid level, not long term fixtures.

 

I'm not really sure he's arguing against a stud OL. I think the arguement is based on what's there to be had. If the option is Anthony Munoz or Calvin Johnson, i think the Munoz picks is the one. But if the pick is Calvin Johnson or Chris Williams...then you go Calvin. Much will depend on where we are picking. Top picks no longer have the financial stigma they once did.

 

I also contend that some of the improvement on the OL must come from FA...something JA definitley $hit the bed on this off-season.

 

I see the only real keepers on this squad as Garza (who should return to guard) and Carimi. That means we need 3 spots filled. I think bring in a FA center, and draft a G and T. Or some combination of the sort.

 

[nfoligno]

Jason. You know I agree with you, but when you list three of the games current or past best WRs, I would argue that would in fact make a dramatic change. If you had 3 of the best ever WRs, Cutler could get rid of the ball lighting fast, and to targets that could pick up first downs potentially every snap.

 

But this isn't a realistic thought. I'm just saying using such an extreme example sort of undercuts the overall arguement.

 

In the end, I don't think we should be talking about Cavlin Johnson, or Orlando Pace. Those are special players who are not easy to find, to say the least. Even if you spend a top 3 pick, those players are still rare finds.

 

The argument is still simple. Upgrade the OL, even the WRs we have today look far better and produce far more. Upgrade the WRs (I'm not saying Rice, etc) the OL still sucks, thus the run game still sucks.

 

The Greenbay game should be all the proof needed. Our OL is so bad that a team can spend all game in nickel and still blow up our run game. Prior to GB, some might have argued that a better WR corp would force defenses into nickel, thus allowing us to run, but the GB game showed that wouldn't even help.

 

On offense, while I want to upgrade our WRs, OL is far and away the top priority (though I would say coaching is neck and neck).

 

 

 

WHAT?! The bolded part is insanity. The two parts are symbiotic. I don't care if you pick up Calvin Johson, he doesn't do a damn thing in the New Orleans game. Period. Cutler would have thrown the same balls because the pressure would have been the exact same. You don't think the opposing defenses worry about Knox and Hester going deep? They have to at least roll some safety support. But when they know they can get to the QB in 1.3 seconds, that is how they will attack.

 

Put it this way:

 

Cutler + Forte + Bears WRs + Best OL in history (90s Cowboys) = Prolific offense

Cutler + Forte + Jerry Rice,Calvin Johson,Steve Largent + Bears OL = Average offense, at best (because of everything NFO said).

 

[jason]

Jason. You know I agree with you, but when you list three of the games current or past best WRs, I would argue that would in fact make a dramatic change. If you had 3 of the best ever WRs, Cutler could get rid of the ball lighting fast, and to targets that could pick up first downs potentially every snap.

 

But this isn't a realistic thought. I'm just saying using such an extreme example sort of undercuts the overall arguement.

 

In the end, I don't think we should be talking about Cavlin Johnson, or Orlando Pace. Those are special players who are not easy to find, to say the least. Even if you spend a top 3 pick, those players are still rare finds.

 

The argument is still simple. Upgrade the OL, even the WRs we have today look far better and produce far more. Upgrade the WRs (I'm not saying Rice, etc) the OL still sucks, thus the run game still sucks.

 

The Greenbay game should be all the proof needed. Our OL is so bad that a team can spend all game in nickel and still blow up our run game. Prior to GB, some might have argued that a better WR corp would force defenses into nickel, thus allowing us to run, but the GB game showed that wouldn't even help.

 

On offense, while I want to upgrade our WRs, OL is far and away the top priority (though I would say coaching is neck and neck).

 

Exaggeration is a talent. What can I say? With that said, even with three HOFers at WR, their production would drop off drastically if the offense they were on had this OL.

[nfoligno]

Well, obviously. Just saying that if you put three of the best WRs EVER on the field, even behind this OL, the offense would be pretty damn good. We'd see crazy arse stuff like a nose tackle, and 10 dropping back into coverage. Even our 5 OL could block a single nose tacke. Um. Maybe

 

Exaggeration is a talent. What can I say? With that said, even with three HOFers at WR, their production would drop off drastically if the offense they were on had this OL.

 

[madlithuanian]

1. Well, you saw it with Calvin! There are guys like that that come around... I agree. It's rare. I'm just saying, you go in trying to get a stud at OL or WR. If it's a tie in talent, etc...go OL be all means. If it's clearly better at WR, you go there. Again, don't handcuff yourself like Martz would!

 

2. I don't either. But I think he's more than passalbe. Plus, we need some experience in there. I would be more than willing to let him go depending on which FA came in.

 

Carmini is the man. At least, it would appear as such.

 

Williams, I am over. He just doesn't seem to have "it". Maybe he will. Injury really isn't hampering him like it did with Columbo. We could let him go, then watch him be a star somewhere else. But, I doubt it.

 

Agreed, with JA leading the charge, we are doomed on the OL. We did ok when we brought Tait and all the FA's for a while, but now we're paying the piper.

 

One. I don't have the article in front of me, but I do recall the hit/miss % highly favoring OL over WR. So a WR you are looking at in the first, who grades out higher, often is still the riskier pick than the OL. If we had a top 5 pick, and there was a Cavlin Johnson type talent, compared to a group of OL graded out no better than 15 range, that's one thing, but how often do you really see that?

 

Two. Frankly, I don't think Garza is all that. I think Garza looks good because of the total crap he is surrounded by, but on a good OL, he would be considered the weak link. For several years he was the favored whipping boy on the OL for many here, including myself. I still don't think he is that good. He just looks good compared to the rest. If we are talking about looking long term, and who on the OL should be part of the picture, I would not consider him. He may stick for now, but only until we can replace him.

 

Carimi obviously looks like a player we consider part of our future. I am up/down when it comes to Chris Williams, who is coming off his worst game, but previously had seemed solid. And I say that as a person he hated the idea of him at OG. But even in the last game, is it really wise to have your LG pull and hit one of the fastest blitzing OLBs on the other side? Mathews beats better OL who line up directly in front of him, yet we were asking Williams to run to the other side of the pocket and block him?

 

But the point is, I'd pencil in Williams and Carimin as part of my long term OL plan, and even those two are in pencil, not pen. That means we need a LT, C and RG, not to mention depth. We need a massive influx of talent across the OL.

 

But as long as Angelo is in charge, I expect little. He simply does not value the position. In the draft, he only takes one high when forced. Otherwise it's a position he takes chances on late, 6th or 7th rd. In FA, he simply doesn't value the position enough to be a player for the better FAs, so he looks for bargains. Even when the pan out, most are band-aid level, not long term fixtures.

 

[madlithuanian]

I aim in overall agreemnt with you...but I disagree about Calvin. he wouldn't drop the balls that were dropped. And in fact, he provies Cutler with a true outlet that was not available on that or any day this season...or decade. Calvin is probably a once in a lifetime talent.

 

I still don't think our Bears WR's would cut the mustard, even with the Cowboys OL. I think they are simply that bad.

 

I disagree. You are simply disrespecting Jerry, Calvin and Steve... But, I still am in overall agreement about the necessity of OL. Just not to the same extent.

 

I'd still settle for either option 1 or 2 over the crap we have now.

 

 

 

WHAT?! The bolded part is insanity. The two parts are symbiotic. I don't care if you pick up Calvin Johson, he doesn't do a damn thing in the New Orleans game. Period. Cutler would have thrown the same balls because the pressure would have been the exact same. You don't think the opposing defenses worry about Knox and Hester going deep? They have to at least roll some safety support. But when they know they can get to the QB in 1.3 seconds, that is how they will attack.

 

Put it this way:

 

Cutler + Forte + Bears WRs + Best OL in history (90s Cowboys) = Prolific offense

Cutler + Forte + Jerry Rice,Calvin Johson,Steve Largent + Bears OL = Average offense, at best (because of everything NFO said).

 

[Bears4Ever_34]

WHAT?! The bolded part is insanity.

It's not.

 

The two parts are symbiotic. I don't care if you pick up Calvin Johson, he doesn't do a damn thing in the New Orleans game. Period.

I would take my chances when one of the best play making receivers in the game is lining up on your side. Guys like that don't have to be open to make a play. You can just throw a jump ball every once in a while and let him out jump the defender. Great WR's make offenses better because they can have an impact on the game even if they don't catch many passes just by virtue of making the defense double team. It opens up more opportunities for other receivers.

 

You don't think the opposing defenses worry about Knox and Hester going deep?

 

Not to the extent of having an actual top flight Wideout to cover. It makes the job easier when neither of them can get off jams or make adjustments on a ball that's not thrown perfectly. Not to mention the ones that are, often bounce off helmets or shoulder pads.

 

The New Orleans game was some what of an aberration with how the play calling went. Martz was the biggest reason to blame for calling those 7 step drops. We've seen him adjust last year to a shorter quicker passing game. Now imagine doing that with a #1 receiver.

 

There is no question our pass protection has room for major improvement but adding that is still not going to solve our issues in the passing game when our guys can't make the routine plays.

[azbearsfan]

No thanks.

 

Moss is only willing to run fades anymore which makes him an easy cover.

 

There is a reason the Pats didnt want him back.

 

 

[madlithuanian]

That Pats have better WR's...we don't!

 

No thanks.

 

Moss is only willing to run fades anymore which makes him an easy cover.

 

There is a reason the Pats didnt want him back.

 

[NAMEDSONPAYTON2]

WHAT?! The bolded part is insanity. The two parts are symbiotic. I don't care if you pick up Calvin Johson, he doesn't do a damn thing in the New Orleans game. Period. Cutler would have thrown the same balls because the pressure would have been the exact same. You don't think the opposing defenses worry about Knox and Hester going deep? They have to at least roll some safety support. But when they know they can get to the QB in 1.3 seconds, that is how they will attack.

 

Put it this way:

 

Cutler + Forte + Bears WRs + Best OL in history (90s Cowboys) = Prolific offense

Cutler + Forte + Jerry Rice,Calvin Johson,Steve Largent + Bears OL = Average offense, at best (because of everything NFO said).

Not all the blame should be either the line or wide recievers, cutler is also to blame. so many here think cutler has no faults. Cutler sucks righ now. Cutler was not worth 2 firsts and a staring qb, NO WAY. Would Denver give us Orton and 2 firsts today, NO. Cutler has thrown more ints for the bears than any other qb comparably in his 2 plus seasons for the bears,he seems to always blame someone else, his body moods are negative,I never see him talk to the O on the sidelines as other qb do, sometimes he stands byhimself,like he's better. For being a profesional qb and getting paid, he sure does have a lot of WAY OFF throws, AND STILL throws off his feet too much. When will cutler make the line and wide recievers look better, huh? I want a pumped up qb with some emotion, not one that walks off the field with his head down, showing signs of giving up,its a negative feeling to me,i can just wonder what the players feel when they see him with the give up body language. Cutller get your game on, mofo

[BearsFan1974]

When will cutler make the line and wide recievers look better, huh?

 

Cutler can't do shit to make the line better. It's not his job to make the line look better. It's the line job to make him look good. Put it this way, if I was hitting you in the head with a hammer over and over, the next time you were with me, you'd flinch because you'd think the hammer was coming. So Cutler gets hit/sacked/knockdown over and over becaus ethe line doesn't block well, so the next time he drops back to pass, he will throw of his back foot to stop the hammer.

 

Once the line gives time, Cutler can start hitting the defense with the hammer and the WRs will look good.

[balta1701-A]

Cutler can't do shit to make the line better. It's not his job to make the line look better. It's the line job to make him look good. Put it this way, if I was hitting you in the head with a hammer over and over, the next time you were with me, you'd flinch because you'd think the hammer was coming. So Cutler gets hit/sacked/knockdown over and over becaus ethe line doesn't block well, so the next time he drops back to pass, he will throw of his back foot to stop the hammer.

 

Once the line gives time, Cutler can start hitting the defense with the hammer and the WRs will look good.

I gotta disagree partially here...Cutler can definitely do stuff to make this line look better. He has been chronically holding the ball too long and staying in the pocket way too much early this season. He is not reading his receivers quickly enough and he is not getting rid of the ball quickly enough.

 

This is of course not the only issue, so don't mistake what I'm saying here...Cutler can and should be better in several ways and that will help the line out significantly if it happens.

[madlithuanian]

Very true. Cutler's been getting a free pass. He shouldn't.

 

He is over-throwing

 

He is showing bad mechanics

 

He is holding the ball too long

 

...he needs to improve on all that.

 

I fear he may be checked out...

 

I gotta disagree partially here...Cutler can definitely do stuff to make this line look better. He has been chronically holding the ball too long and staying in the pocket way too much early this season. He is not reading his receivers quickly enough and he is not getting rid of the ball quickly enough.

 

This is of course not the only issue, so don't mistake what I'm saying here...Cutler can and should be better in several ways and that will help the line out significantly if it happens.

 

[BearsFan1974]

Very true. Cutler's been getting a free pass. He shouldn't.

 

He is over-throwing

 

He is showing bad mechanics

 

He is holding the ball too long

 

...he needs to improve on all that.

 

I fear he may be checked out...

 

Over throwing---Back foot from fear of getting gang raped by 4-275lb D-Linemen

Bad Mechanics---^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Holding the ball too long---it's easier to get a 1st down from 2nd or 3rd and long than on defense after an interception. If he got rid of the ball, then we'd bash for throwing a pick. The line hasn't been giving him enough time either to get out of the pocket.

 

My cup is half-full, but the line needs to do a better job and give him time. If he gets time, we all see what we can do.

[jason]

Over throwing---Back foot from fear of getting gang raped by 4-275lb D-Linemen

Bad Mechanics---^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Holding the ball too long---it's easier to get a 1st down from 2nd or 3rd and long than on defense after an interception. If he got rid of the ball, then we'd bash for throwing a pick. The line hasn't been giving him enough time either to get out of the pocket.

 

My cup is half-full, but the line needs to do a better job and give him time. If he gets time, we all see what we can do.

 

Agreed. This is not a chicken-and-egg situation. Cutler regresses when the OL plays like garbage. The OL rarely plays otherwise, so Cutler's flaws will be magnified. It's not like Cutler doesn't step up into the pocket when he has consistently gotten one. And it's not like the OL suffers as a result of Cutler's bad mechanics. The only Cutler--->OL connection is that the OL gets sack statistics when Cutler holds onto the ball.

 

Could he do better? Absolutely. Do I blame him? Not much. Cutler's bad mechanics and bad habits are almost entirely based on feeling the heat of opposing defenders as they collapse his miniscule pocket and attempt to reorganize his organs with yet another unhindered path to his ultimately defenseless body.