NAMEDSONPAYTON2 Posted October 5, 2011 Report Share Posted October 5, 2011 Why is it when Cutler sucks, so much blame goes on the line. but when Forte has 100- 200 yards the line really gets no credit. Forte has had success with this line the last 3 years, is our line really that bad? Or,or, or could cutler be way overrated by many bear fans. The weakest or one of the supposably weakest lines in the nfl has a running back with more than 200 yards rushing in the 4th game is the problem?????????????. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfoligno Posted October 5, 2011 Report Share Posted October 5, 2011 One, Forte was great, but at the same time, in the prior three games he was getting drilled in the backfield. Two, As good as Forte has been, his rushing hasn't been huge. Last year was his first over 4.0 ypc average. He's great because of everything he does, but as a pure rusher, he hasn't been the most consistent, and a big part of that is the OL. Three, Even if the OL is run blocking well, that doesn't mean they pass block well. Four, I think Cutler has gotten plenty of blame, regardless of the OL. Cutler isn't given a free pass. With that said, our OL does suck. They had ONE game where they run blocked well, opening holes, but prior to this game, they were getting blown up. Forte was getting hit in the backfield and Cutler was under constant pressure Why is it when Cutler sucks, so much blame goes on the line. but when Forte has 100- 200 yards the line really gets no credit. Forte has had success with this line the last 3 years, is our line really that bad? Or,or, or could cutler be way overrated by many bear fans. The weakest or one of the supposably weakest lines in the nfl has a running back with more than 200 yards rushing in the 4th game is the problem?????????????. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bears4Ever_34 Posted October 5, 2011 Report Share Posted October 5, 2011 3 things.. - Below average offensive line - Below average WR's - Scheme that doesn't fit Cutler's strengths or the team's personnel. Combine all of those things and you get a quarterback that has no chance to succeed. Cutler may very well be not as good as we thought he'd be but we won't really ever know until we put talent around him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balta1701-A Posted October 5, 2011 Report Share Posted October 5, 2011 - Scheme that doesn't fit Cutler's strengths or the team's personnel. Serious question: what are the strengths Cutler has which aren't being used by this scheme? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted October 5, 2011 Report Share Posted October 5, 2011 agreed... One, Forte was great, but at the same time, in the prior three games he was getting drilled in the backfield. Two, As good as Forte has been, his rushing hasn't been huge. Last year was his first over 4.0 ypc average. He's great because of everything he does, but as a pure rusher, he hasn't been the most consistent, and a big part of that is the OL. Three, Even if the OL is run blocking well, that doesn't mean they pass block well. Four, I think Cutler has gotten plenty of blame, regardless of the OL. Cutler isn't given a free pass. With that said, our OL does suck. They had ONE game where they run blocked well, opening holes, but prior to this game, they were getting blown up. Forte was getting hit in the backfield and Cutler was under constant pressure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted October 5, 2011 Report Share Posted October 5, 2011 Mobility Audible ability ..to name a few. Serious question: what are the strengths Cutler has which aren't being used by this scheme? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bears4Ever_34 Posted October 5, 2011 Report Share Posted October 5, 2011 Serious question: what are the strengths Cutler has which aren't being used by this scheme? Mike Martz's scheme calls for quarterbacks to trust their receivers to be in a certain spot at a certain time. Cutler has never showed he's comfortable in doing that. He often times pump fakes and pump fakes sitting there waiting for a receiver to get open before he throws it. When you are taking 7 step drops, its absolutely essential that you get the ball out. Warner excelled in that system because A.) He's one of the most accurate quarterbacks in the history of football B.) He had the offensive line that gave him enough time to let his receivers get downfield and C.) His receivers had actual NFL caliber talent and got open. Mike Shannahan got the most out of Cutler's strengths and that offense was catered perfectly to his skill set (which is probably the reason they drafted him in the first place). For a big guy, Cutler was really good at throwing outside of the pocket. Their offense featured him rolling out alot of the time as well as making him get rid of the ball quickly to his receivers and let them get YAC. In Martz's system, a quarterback isn't even allowed to call audibles which only further hinders what Cutler is able to do in a football game. It's probably the worst possible offense that you could try to fit Jay in, really. That's why I never liked the hiring of Martz to begin with. We need a coordinator that runs a West Coast offense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkntailgater Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Serious question: what are the strengths Cutler has which aren't being used by this scheme? Cutler has been a mobil style QB. His style of play would be better if he was in a scheme like Steve Young had back in the day. Something where you use a moving pocket and the QB gets a chance to roll out and throw on the move. This has been said over and over, but a QB can only play to his potential when the Offensive scheme matches the QB's style of play. Perfect example. Look at the Florida Gators. John Brantley looked like crap running a Tim Tebow style offense. They brought in Charlie Weis (who should have come here) and Brantley's numbers have about double what he did last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bears4Ever_34 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 EDIT: Woops, wrong thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 One, Forte was great, but at the same time, in the prior three games he was getting drilled in the backfield. Two, As good as Forte has been, his rushing hasn't been huge. Last year was his first over 4.0 ypc average. He's great because of everything he does, but as a pure rusher, he hasn't been the most consistent, and a big part of that is the OL. Three, Even if the OL is run blocking well, that doesn't mean they pass block well. Four, I think Cutler has gotten plenty of blame, regardless of the OL. Cutler isn't given a free pass. With that said, our OL does suck. They had ONE game where they run blocked well, opening holes, but prior to this game, they were getting blown up. Forte was getting hit in the backfield and Cutler was under constant pressure Five, Carolina has one of the worst rush defenses in the NFL. Forte blowing up was absolutely no surprise. Otherwise, great list. It's exactly why the OL got minimal credit after they dump-trucked a JV defense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azbearsfan Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Mike Martz's scheme calls for quarterbacks to trust their receivers to be in a certain spot at a certain time. Cutler has never showed he's comfortable in doing that. He often times pump fakes and pump fakes sitting there waiting for a receiver to get open before he throws it. When you are taking 7 step drops, its absolutely essential that you get the ball out. Warner excelled in that system because A.) He's one of the most accurate quarterbacks in the history of football B.) He had the offensive line that gave him enough time to let his receivers get downfield and C.) His receivers had actual NFL caliber talent and got open. Mike Shannahan got the most out of Cutler's strengths and that offense was catered perfectly to his skill set (which is probably the reason they drafted him in the first place). For a big guy, Cutler was really good at throwing outside of the pocket. Their offense featured him rolling out alot of the time as well as making him get rid of the ball quickly to his receivers and let them get YAC. In Martz's system, a quarterback isn't even allowed to call audibles which only further hinders what Cutler is able to do in a football game. It's probably the worst possible offense that you could try to fit Jay in, really. That's why I never liked the hiring of Martz to begin with. We need a coordinator that runs a West Coast offense. The first issue I had with the Martz hiring is the protection of the qb. The Martz offense gets QB's hit anyways. Pairing it with this O-Line makes it that much worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemonej Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Mike Martz's scheme calls for quarterbacks to trust their receivers to be in a certain spot at a certain time. Cutler has never showed he's comfortable in doing that. He often times pump fakes and pump fakes sitting there waiting for a receiver to get open before he throws it. When you are taking 7 step drops, its absolutely essential that you get the ball out. Warner excelled in that system because A.) He's one of the most accurate quarterbacks in the history of football B.) He had the offensive line that gave him enough time to let his receivers get downfield and C.) His receivers had actual NFL caliber talent and got open. Mike Shannahan got the most out of Cutler's strengths and that offense was catered perfectly to his skill set (which is probably the reason they drafted him in the first place). For a big guy, Cutler was really good at throwing outside of the pocket. Their offense featured him rolling out alot of the time as well as making him get rid of the ball quickly to his receivers and let them get YAC. In Martz's system, a quarterback isn't even allowed to call audibles which only further hinders what Cutler is able to do in a football game. It's probably the worst possible offense that you could try to fit Jay in, really. That's why I never liked the hiring of Martz to begin with. We need a coordinator that runs a West Coast offense. Ron Turner allegedly ran a WCO and Cutler and he didn't see eye to eye allegedly. I do believe that an offense that reigns Cutler in and utilizes the running game would make him more affective and make the Bears offense work better. We really can't pin point what Martz's offense is anymore. This year and last season is no different.He was doing the same moronic play calling until the Dallas game in the 2nd half when all of a sudden the Bears started getting rid of the ball quickly.He felt he satisfied the masses for that game and went right back to calling the deep drops and empty backfield plays.Once Cutler got knocked senseless in the Giants game, he then was reigned in and started to feature Forte. As well as talent evaluation the problem is play calling. Adapt your plays to your personnel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 The first issue I had with the Martz hiring is the protection of the qb. The Martz offense gets QB's hit anyways. Pairing it with this O-Line makes it that much worse. You're right, I just wish it wasn't such a chicken-and-egg dilemma. Should the Bears have brought in a different OC since the OL is the worst in the NFL? or Should the OL have been upgraded, so the OC could actually implement an offense? As it stands, I think they ignored #1 and virtually ignored #2, thereby leaving the Bears in a difficult situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Hochuli 3:16 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Cutler isn't comfortable throwing to spots where his WR's should be, because well, the WR's suck and I don't think any QB would trust this group. The OL is bad, but they're athletic. Typically, athletic o-linemen are better run blockers than pass blockers because they can get out into space quicker and pull with more ease. MadLith hit the nail on the head- Cutler loves throwing on the run. Last year, although it wasn't shown a lot, he was awesome at it as well. In his Pro Bowl year, he made his money throwing on bootlegs. The audibling thing is ridiculous but it's a Martz thing. Warner wasn't allowed to do it either. Here's Matt Bowen's opinion. on why it's not working with Cutler and Martz. (click the one that says "CTL panel discusses..." It should be the 5th one) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 The chicken has salmonella and the eggs are rotten. Both need to be tossed out with the garbage and we need to go grocery shopping at a better market with a better buyer. Can Theo Epstean GM the Bears as well? There's a reason Martz was on TV vs. coaching...and there's a reason why so many of our OL were drafted so low... Fail on both. You're right, I just wish it wasn't such a chicken-and-egg dilemma. Should the Bears have brought in a different OC since the OL is the worst in the NFL? or Should the OL have been upgraded, so the OC could actually implement an offense? As it stands, I think they ignored #1 and virtually ignored #2, thereby leaving the Bears in a difficult situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted October 9, 2011 Report Share Posted October 9, 2011 3 things.. - Below average offensive line - Below average WR's - Scheme that doesn't fit Cutler's strengths or the team's personnel. Combine all of those things and you get a quarterback that has no chance to succeed. Cutler may very well be not as good as we thought he'd be but we won't really ever know until we put talent around him. You hit that right on. I dont think Culter is great but had the potenial to be a top 10 qb in this league. He came in improved and doing the right things and have gotten beat up. Do you think Brady, Bress, would be doing as well if they have taken the beating Cutler has? It comes down to being a mental thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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