Would You Trust This Man To Draft Your Team?

[ChileBear]

Martz wasn't a bad OC this year. Yes, he had his dumbass games like vs GB and NO, but Cutler really came on at the end of this year and week 4 and on this year.

 

With Todd Graham going to ASU, I really hope this means Martz is back next year.

I agree. Cutler could really take off with the same system next year. And the way things are going in the NFC, we are going to need points from the O in bunches to compete.

We also are going to need to get some depth on D, these guys are aging.

[lemonej]

I'll agree that there have been some boneheaded moves made while Angelo has been here, but I believe it's a solid and valid question who those moves belonged to and whether Angelo had the juice to block them at the time.

 

 

 

I disagree that Angelo "tweeked the roster to help the coach". In fact, I would suggest that Angelo purposely denied Jauron a bunch of veterans that he would have preferred to keep. Let's start on the defensive line. Gone were starters Flanigan and Wells along with Van Tuinei, Troy Wilson, Brad Culpepper, and Clyde Simmons. The LB corps lost veterans Sean Harris and Barry Minter. Also cut loose were previous high picks Enis and McNown along with vet guard Todd Perry and vet receivers Bobby Engram and Eddie Kennison.

 

Now to me, that sounds like a new GM cutting deadwood that the previous brain trust had kept around.

 

 

 

I think that we also have to look at what happened to the coaching staff after Lovie got his big new contract. The most obvious and talked about was Lovie's decision to let Ron Rivera go and promote Bob Babich in his place. Also let go were QB coach Wade Wilson, DL coach Don Johnson, Asst. OL coach Harold Goodwin, and Off. QC coach Mike Bajakian.

 

So, how drastically different were the 13-3 2006 team and the 7-9 2007 team? Was Thomas Jones personally responsible for a 5 win difference? Was Darwin Walker so much worse than Tank Johnson that the team tanked? It makes sense to me that the new DC and DL coach made the biggest difference - and that's not on the GM.

 

 

 

All this has to do with is that I think Angelo's getting all the blame when it's what I see as a structural problem. I'm a firm believer in a top down structure where the coach reports to the GM. I hated the setup when Jauron and Hatley shared power, loved it when Angelo got the juice back after hiring Lovie, and hated it again after Lovie got his extension.

 

Just think how it might change the dynamics. With a top down structure, Angelo is in charge. He has personnel people on one side of the table, and coaches on the other - they all report to him. Now after Lovie gets his extension and makes somewhere between 8 to 10 times as much as Angelo, it works completely differently. Did Angelo retain final say on draft day? I think he probably did - but with the understanding that if he completely went against Lovie's wishes, he could be replaced FAR more cheaply than Lovie. It's just my impression that Angelo does a fine job when he's actually in charge.

Okay that is why we went at this like Godzilla vs Rodan.LOL We clearly have a different view of how well JA is doing and whether he wields absolute power or not. I will agree that who is more liked by the family is in question because during negotiations for Lovie's first extension it was rumored that Virginia absolutely adored Lovie so when you bring up that variable I have to agree but, the fact that he has restructured his whole personnel department and jettisoned some long time scouts with Bobby DePaul being the most notable. If that doesn't say something is wrong with the way we do things then you and me can agree to disagree. BTW Happy Holidays LT!!

[LT2_3]

Okay that is why we went at this like Godzilla vs Rodan.LOL We clearly have a different view of how well JA is doing and whether he wields absolute power or not. I will agree that who is more liked by the family is in question because during negotiations for Lovie's first extension it was rumored that Virginia absolutely adored Lovie so when you bring up that variable I have to agree but, the fact that he has restructured his whole personnel department and jettisoned some long time scouts with Bobby DePaul being the most notable. If that doesn't say something is wrong with the way we do things then you and me can agree to disagree. BTW Happy Holidays LT!!

 

I agree that it's a clear indicator that decision making at the higher echelons of Halas Hall are a bit wonky. I think Angelo restructured things because he had no choice. I envision a situation in the war room where the scouts are saying "pick this guy" (and it could have been over James Starks from what I've inferred from reading things said by DePaul or Gabriel) and the coaching staff was saying "No, pick this guy". Then Angelo is stuck with having to piss someone off and the coaching staff doesn't report to him. So, while I'm sure that many (myself included) were sorry to see those guys go, it probably came to a head because Angelo was the GM in name only - which weakened the positions of the guys that were paid to scout the players. They were probably asking the simple question "Why do we spend all this time scouting these players if our recommendations keep getting overruled by the coach?" It's a valid question for them to ask.

 

Next question is where should the Bears go from here? Another excellent question. If they can get rid of Lovie and let the personnel department make the personnel decisions again, then I say let Angelo stay. If they're determined to make a change and keep Lovie, they need to bring in someone as VP of football operations instead of a GM. That way they get back to the right top down structure with the coach reporting to someone other than Ted Phillips.

 

And Happy Holidays to you too.

[madlithuanian]

Getting rid of Sweatty Teddy would be a HUGE plus!

 

I agree that it's a clear indicator that decision making at the higher echelons of Halas Hall are a bit wonky. I think Angelo restructured things because he had no choice. I envision a situation in the war room where the scouts are saying "pick this guy" (and it could have been over James Starks from what I've inferred from reading things said by DePaul or Gabriel) and the coaching staff was saying "No, pick this guy". Then Angelo is stuck with having to piss someone off and the coaching staff doesn't report to him. So, while I'm sure that many (myself included) were sorry to see those guys go, it probably came to a head because Angelo was the GM in name only - which weakened the positions of the guys that were paid to scout the players. They were probably asking the simple question "Why do we spend all this time scouting these players if our recommendations keep getting overruled by the coach?" It's a valid question for them to ask.

 

Next question is where should the Bears go from here? Another excellent question. If they can get rid of Lovie and let the personnel department make the personnel decisions again, then I say let Angelo stay. If they're determined to make a change and keep Lovie, they need to bring in someone as VP of football operations instead of a GM. That way they get back to the right top down structure with the coach reporting to someone other than Ted Phillips.

 

And Happy Holidays to you too.

 

[lemonej]

I agree that it's a clear indicator that decision making at the higher echelons of Halas Hall are a bit wonky. I think Angelo restructured things because he had no choice. I envision a situation in the war room where the scouts are saying "pick this guy" (and it could have been over James Starks from what I've inferred from reading things said by DePaul or Gabriel) and the coaching staff was saying "No, pick this guy". Then Angelo is stuck with having to piss someone off and the coaching staff doesn't report to him. So, while I'm sure that many (myself included) were sorry to see those guys go, it probably came to a head because Angelo was the GM in name only - which weakened the positions of the guys that were paid to scout the players. They were probably asking the simple question "Why do we spend all this time scouting these players if our recommendations keep getting overruled by the coach?" It's a valid question for them to ask.

 

Next question is where should the Bears go from here? Another excellent question. If they can get rid of Lovie and let the personnel department make the personnel decisions again, then I say let Angelo stay. If they're determined to make a change and keep Lovie, they need to bring in someone as VP of football operations instead of a GM. That way they get back to the right top down structure with the coach reporting to someone other than Ted Phillips.

 

And Happy Holidays to you too.

I knew we would agree on something! I just believe that it is going to change only if JA retires or the Bears tank next year and Lovie gets fired because as you have indicated in the past how this team doesn't eat multiple years of HC's contracts. I do believe that Lovie and his agent were smart enouogh to not have a buyout option in his latest extension. Teddy is a real interesting addition to the mix because another rumor that has been floated is that they put Teddy in position to get a stadium deal and now that that is done now what? Most of us felt that when Ted was appointed he was a puppet for the family and there hasn't been a lot to change that perception except the trading for Cutler and his extension and the dropping of big coin on Peppers, Taylor and Manushamuneula. As far as the top down structure since in early the 70's I posted on this same thread(lol) that I was a big fan of Jim Finks I agree with your idea of the personnel department doing their job and the coach giving them a "Wish List". I'm sure you and me both agre that it is real good that no one above JA has the final vote on draft picks because IMO it would be worst than it is now. I just wonder if JA does retire is a rubber stamp to Ruskell taking over IMO after the draft next spring.

 

Just for the record you know I don't question you on numbers so basically I had actually did do some research but, I don't know if my numbers compiled with an "Old School" calculator measure up so maybe me rounding my numbers up or down didn't make sense to you but believe me, I really thought I had a good theme going (lol).