jason Posted November 8, 2012 Report Share Posted November 8, 2012 This would be a difficult pill to swallow. http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown...00408--nfl.html I agree with the quote in the article. This guys gets paid millions to be available on 16 days a year. If he is out one of those games because of something non-football related, I think he should be fined a game check. I know it sounds harsh, but he's being paid to play the game. He's not being paid to play it unless, ya know, he's got other stuff going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted November 8, 2012 Report Share Posted November 8, 2012 From what I heard today. Peanut said that he plans to be there Sunday and his wife will be induced into labor on Monday. Gotta think the docs may be Bears fans... But all kidding aside, he can do what he wants and I'm 100% behind him. It's one thing to miss games because you're lazy, hungover, etc...it's another for family. Also, keep in mind, this is the same man that already lost a very young daughter to a rare heart disorder a few years back. If he wants to be there, damn well he should be there. As a fan, I'd love him to be at the game. But as a man, I fully respect whatever decision he makes. One thing for sure...this may only impact this game. He'll be there when we play in the Super Bowl... That game is far more important. I fully understand the take, and I have no problem with it. I just simply feel that, unlike medical professionals, police, fire, military, etc...an athlete can miss a game when a family matter as such is concerned. It's up to the team to deal with it, and they are behind his decision. His teammates are as well. That's all I really care about... This would be a difficult pill to swallow. http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown...00408--nfl.html I agree with the quote in the article. This guys gets paid millions to be available on 16 days a year. If he is out one of those games because of something non-football related, I think he should be fined a game check. I know it sounds harsh, but he's being paid to play the game. He's not being paid to play it unless, ya know, he's got other stuff going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChileBear Posted November 8, 2012 Report Share Posted November 8, 2012 This would be a difficult pill to swallow. http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown...00408--nfl.html I agree with the quote in the article. This guys gets paid millions to be available on 16 days a year. If he is out one of those games because of something non-football related, I think he should be fined a game check. I know it sounds harsh, but he's being paid to play the game. He's not being paid to play it unless, ya know, he's got other stuff going on. I hear ya, but I don't agree. Tillman may play super-human, but he still is a guy who has a family. I'm hoping he gets to lay, but if his wife is in labor he should be with her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted November 8, 2012 Report Share Posted November 8, 2012 From what I heard today. Peanut said that he plans to be there Sunday and his wife will be induced into labor on Monday. Gotta think the docs may be Bears fans... But all kidding aside, he can do what he wants and I'm 100% behind him. It's one thing to miss games because you're lazy, hungover, etc...it's another for family. Also, keep in mind, this is the same man that already lost a very young daughter to a rare heart disorder a few years back. If he wants to be there, damn well he should be there. As a fan, I'd love him to be at the game. But as a man, I fully respect whatever decision he makes. One thing for sure...this may only impact this game. He'll be there when we play in the Super Bowl... That game is far more important. I fully understand the take, and I have no problem with it. I just simply feel that, unlike medical professionals, police, fire, military, etc...an athlete can miss a game when a family matter as such is concerned. It's up to the team to deal with it, and they are behind his decision. His teammates are as well. That's all I really care about... x2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted November 8, 2012 Report Share Posted November 8, 2012 I tend to agree with this take more...(some NSFW language) http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2012/11/8/3615...rs-florio-birth Charles Tillman is a man By Bobby B. Wheel on Nov 8, 9:14a Charles Tillman may miss a football game to attend the birth of his child. Bobby Big Wheel explains why it's idiotic to suggest that he should be forced to play, Mike Florio. Charles Tillman is a man When you call an athlete a "man" it usually connotes that he's grown into his role and plays like a true pro. Grit, hustle, determination; all the sportswritery words apply to him. Charles Tillman is a man. Quarterbacks don't throw in his direction any more. He leads the league in forced fumbles with seven (three players are tied for second place with four apiece). Tillman made Calvin Johnson look like Alvin Harper on national TV. Even President Obama knows who he is; he singled out Tillman as a reason why the Bears could win the Super Bowl in his Monday Night Football interview with Chris Berman. The president sure as hell doesn't know who I am (Biden does though; he's a former Deadspin commenter too). So yeah, Charles Tillman plays like a man. Charles Tillman is a man Charles Tillman is a man in that other sense, that he's got a Y chromosome and he's reached adulthood. Adulthood, of course, doesn't always align with age. Plenty of Peter Pans out there are older than Tillman but wouldn't qualify as men, but Tillman certainly does. He's spent years honing his craft to reach the top of his profession. He has a charitable organization that, unlike a lot of athletes' charitable foundations, isn't just a front to employ lazy relatives and helps over 80,000 critically ill children per year. He's also a husband to one and a father to three. Sounds like a man to me. Charles Tillman is a man Charles Tillman is a man whose wife is pregnant with a baby that is due on Sunday. The Bears play the Texans on Sunday night, but he might miss the game to witness the birth of his child. That's because his daughter Tiana was born with an enlarged heart and after that ordeal Tillman decided that family would come before football. Tillman, like me, is one of those people who was lucky enough to have a father who is his role model. And he also knows that family, not football, will be there for you if you hit rock bottom. It makes sense that Tillman would prioritize family because he understands just how great a father who loves you unconditionally can be. That unconditional love can manifest itself in many ways. Some men think it requires working even when it means missing time with your family so you can support them. Tillman takes a different stance. But he's a man, so it's his prerogative to decide whether he attends the birth of his child or plays a football game. Charles Tillman is a man Charles Tillman is a man who wants to see the birth of his child. Set aside the fact that seeing the birth of a human being that you created is a fantastic and rare experience, he may just want to go to support his wife. It's easy for a man to get a woman pregnant. A lot of fun too. It's hard for a woman to carry a healthy baby to term. From what I gather, it's not a lot of fun. The least a man can do is show up for the painful payoff of that pregnancy. Charles Tillman is a man The fact that Charles Tillman is a man seems lost on Mike Florio. The Pro Football Talk impresario thinks that players should not miss games to witness the birth of their children. His reasoning is easy to debunk: Football players sign up to be available no matter what 16 days a year. Football players miss games all the time due to injuries and illness, which are side effects of being human beings. I suppose you could argue that Tillman is making a choice to miss a game whereas injuries involuntarily keep players out of the game. In that case, please note that Dennis Dixon, Philip Rivers, Robert Marve and many others have played football on torn ACLs. It's often possible for an injured player to suit up, but most would rather recuperate so they will be in peak playing condition for future games. For all we know, Tillman wouldn't be able to focus if he knew his wife was in labor during the game.The decision is his. Deal with it. Until we replace football players with Cleatuses, ownership and fans need to deal with the fact that players will miss games because they are, in fact, people. Players should only engage in "family expansion activities" when they are unlikely to produce a child during football season. Seriously, Florio called sex "family expansion activities." Most people get over their hangup of calling intercourse "sex" around the age of 9. Anyway, football season lasts from early September to early February. I'd love to hear Florio's plan to keep men in their 20s who are beloved by attractive women from having sex for five months, but I imagine that it involves pixie dust. Players' wives shouldn't give birth between September and February. My birthday is in August, and after a few glasses of white wine my mother will gladly tell you about how awful it is to be nine months pregnant in the middle of summer. In Mike Florio's world that doesn't matter because the football team, not the actual women giving birth to children, is paramount. It never even crossed Mike Florio's mind that a woman might want to have a say in when she gives birth. Teams shouldn't suffer the consequences of players fathering children. Never mind the fact that Lovie Smith supports Tillman's decision and arguing that the Bears don't want him to play a game instead of seeing the birth of his child is a moot point. Federal law (the Family Medical Leave Act) requires employers to offer employees up to 12 weeks unpaid leave to attend to family matters such as Tillman's. And the Thirteenth Amendment makes it so that you cannot force someone to work for you. Florio is a lawyer, so he should know that Tillman has a legal right to miss a game to see the birth of his child. Teams hire men, not fungible pass defending units. Charles Tillman is a man And Mike Florio doesn't care. He's made a career out of stirring shit, and not even attempting to report news in a measured manner. He even tracks player arrests with a "Turd Watch" because he's the only lawyer on the planet who thinks that an arrested person is automatically guilty (and that being guilty of any crime makes one a turd). His commenters largely agree with him, mostly because they, too, like the way the floor feels on their knuckles as they walk. Charles Tillman is just another vehicle for Mike Florio to get pageviews by saying controversial stuff while hoping people who think he's full of shit come back to the site because he does a good job of purveying intelligence (please note that @NFL_ATL gives you the same intel as PFT* but has none of its crap agenda). Florio has the power to make reckless and hacky statements, but the next time that he pulls his head out of his ass long enough to write one he should act like a professional and remember that when he writes about a football player he writes about an actual person. In other words, Mike Florio needs to start acting like a freakin man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted November 8, 2012 Report Share Posted November 8, 2012 Florio now backtracking after thinking about it or bowing to pressure....good for him. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/...end-childbirth/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrizzlyBear Posted November 8, 2012 Report Share Posted November 8, 2012 This would be a difficult pill to swallow. http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown...00408--nfl.html I agree with the quote in the article. This guys gets paid millions to be available on 16 days a year. If he is out one of those games because of something non-football related, I think he should be fined a game check. I know it sounds harsh, but he's being paid to play the game. He's not being paid to play it unless, ya know, he's got other stuff going on. Dude , this is not the Army or Marines, "If we wanted you to have a family we would issue you one." I applaud him for being a family man. it shows its not all about football., Iam a bigger fan of his for being just that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TerraTor Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 Honestly these talk about how their jobs aren't like ours. They are exactly right You sign a contract for a ton of guaranteed money regardless of performance, and are asked to show up for 4 hours, 16 Sundays out of 52. Then you ask for personal days. Personally, I think there should be requirements to work. Plenty of guys I work with were at the office 9 hours and calling hospital to check in... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'TD' Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 Honestly these talk about how their jobs aren't like ours. They are exactly right You sign a contract for a ton of guaranteed money regardless of performance, and are asked to show up for 4 hours, 16 Sundays out of 52. Then you ask for personal days. Personally, I think there should be requirements to work. Plenty of guys I work with were at the office 9 hours and calling hospital to check in... I'd let Tillman, and only him miss a day for that. After what he went through with his daughter is unimmaginable, and once he came back and everything was good with her, he started playing his best football. I'd love to see him shut down Johnson, be in contention for defensive player of the year and so on, but I don't blame him for possibly missing and think it's honorable that Lovie is willing to say family first on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connorbear Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 This would be a difficult pill to swallow. http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown...00408--nfl.html I agree with the quote in the article. This guys gets paid millions to be available on 16 days a year. If he is out one of those games because of something non-football related, I think he should be fined a game check. I know it sounds harsh, but he's being paid to play the game. He's not being paid to play it unless, ya know, he's got other stuff going on. I'm going disagree 100%. I'm sure if his contract said he would lose a paycheck, Charles wouldn't give a crap. This is his wife and family. Football is just game. His priorities are in the absolute right place. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted November 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 Dude , this is not the Army or Marines, "If we wanted you to have a family we would issue you one." I applaud him for being a family man. it shows its not all about football., Iam a bigger fan of his for being just that. I know it's not. That's why I said if he misses a game he should be fined the game check. That implies he has the option to miss a day/game, a privilege the military does not have. Or maybe he should volunteer a game check for not actually playing for his money? How is what I suggest any different from any other job? If your employer says, "Be there on Monday. It's an incredibly important day for us. Not having you there will negatively affect the company." A company that can't rely on its employees to be there when it most matters is a company that will have problems. Negative counseling has come from much less. The difference, of course, is that Tillman only has to show up for work 16 days a year. Sure, he has to train, workout, study, etc., but he only has to be at work 16 days a year. It's a relatively moot point now since he said he was going to play, but at what point does the tide turn for some of you? Week 1: "Sorry, but my baby is going to be born." Week 6: "Sorry, but my other kid is having their most special birthday party ever." Week 9: "Sorry, but my aunt is going in for surgery and moral support is necessary." Week 16: "Sorry, my best friend had a death in the family; I need to be there for him." What then? I know it's an unlikely hypothetical, but it's still directly tied to the main point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted November 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 I'm going disagree 100%. I'm sure if his contract said he would lose a paycheck, Charles wouldn't give a crap. This is his wife and family. Football is just game. His priorities are in the absolute right place. Peace I agree 100%. His priorities ARE in the right place. It's faith, family, football, in that order. But look at it from the Bears' business perspective. And he probably would forfeit a game check without blinking, which is why it would be the right thing to do for both sides. It isn't like the dude needs the money to support the new kid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bears4Ever_34 Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 I don't have a problem with him if he misses the game. There are things more important than football, and Tillman has his priorities lined up. I think taking away a game check is a little bit of a slap in the face. You either preach family first or you don't. Lovie says family first. I don't think it would be right to Tillman if the Bears were to take away his check. It would just look bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 I may be wrong, but I believe their is a law that gives employees official paid time off for childbirth. I am not certain as I don't have kids and haven't gone through the process... In fact, my work encourages the same. There has not been one man at my place of employment that has not been there for his wife during birth and they were paid as if they worked the day. It's pretty up to the employer (barring any legal issue I'm not aware of...as I'm not a lawyer nor play one on TV). And it's apparent that the employer would be OK with it. So, that's pretty much the end of the story. No tide turns... Tillman or anyone can ask an employer for any of the ridiculous examples you put forth. But, it's up to the employer to determine of that's legit. I'd imagine the silly examples you mentioned would not be. Not everything is black and white. These are human beings, not products. You know Tillman lost a child, right? This man, who has given us fans so much, is simply asking for one day that means more than the world to him. Sounds like he has his priorities straight to me... I know it's not. That's why I said if he misses a game he should be fined the game check. That implies he has the option to miss a day/game, a privilege the military does not have. Or maybe he should volunteer a game check for not actually playing for his money? How is what I suggest any different from any other job? If your employer says, "Be there on Monday. It's an incredibly important day for us. Not having you there will negatively affect the company." A company that can't rely on its employees to be there when it most matters is a company that will have problems. Negative counseling has come from much less. The difference, of course, is that Tillman only has to show up for work 16 days a year. Sure, he has to train, workout, study, etc., but he only has to be at work 16 days a year. It's a relatively moot point now since he said he was going to play, but at what point does the tide turn for some of you? Week 1: "Sorry, but my baby is going to be born." Week 6: "Sorry, but my other kid is having their most special birthday party ever." Week 9: "Sorry, but my aunt is going in for surgery and moral support is necessary." Week 16: "Sorry, my best friend had a death in the family; I need to be there for him." What then? I know it's an unlikely hypothetical, but it's still directly tied to the main point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 Agreed Connor. I'm going disagree 100%. I'm sure if his contract said he would lose a paycheck, Charles wouldn't give a crap. This is his wife and family. Football is just game. His priorities are in the absolute right place. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 Well said. I don't have a problem with him if he misses the game. There are things more important than football, and Tillman has his priorities lined up. I think taking away a game check is a little bit of a slap in the face. You either preach family first or you don't. Lovie says family first. I don't think it would be right to Tillman if the Bears were to take away his check. It would just look bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connorbear Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 I may be wrong, but I believe their is a law that gives employees official paid time off for childbirth. I am not certain as I don't have kids and haven't gone through the process... In fact, my work encourages the same. There has not been one man at my place of employment that has not been there for his wife during birth and they were paid as if they worked the day. It's pretty up to the employer (barring any legal issue I'm not aware of...as I'm not a lawyer nor play one on TV). And it's apparent that the employer would be OK with it. So, that's pretty much the end of the story. No tide turns... Tillman or anyone can ask an employer for any of the ridiculous examples you put forth. But, it's up to the employer to determine of that's legit. I'd imagine the silly examples you mentioned would not be. Not everything is black and white. These are human beings, not products. You know Tillman lost a child, right? This man, who has given us fans so much, is simply asking for one day that means more than the world to him. Sounds like he has his priorities straight to me... Peanut didn't lose a child. His daughter had to have a heart transplant but the point is still valid. In the end the Bears have said he can do what he needs to do. End of discussion. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 Thank you for clarifying that! I had thought she had passed. I'm very happy I was wrong! Peanut didn't lose a child. His daughter had to have a heart transplant but the point is still valid. In the end the Bears have said he can do what he needs to do. End of discussion. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 I may be wrong, but I believe their is a law that gives employees official paid time off for childbirth. I am not certain as I don't have kids and haven't gone through the process... Its called "Family Medical Leave Act" (FMLA) of 1993. It doesn't "give" you time off, per se, but allows you time off if you need it to deal with what you describe. The employee would also need leave to draw from in order to actually "use" leave. In most places it would be your payroll/HR section that should be ultimately familar with how it works. Sorry, I digress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madlithuanian Posted November 9, 2012 Report Share Posted November 9, 2012 That's what I was thinking of...thanks for clarifying. Its called "Family Medical Leave Act" (FMLA) of 1993. It doesn't "give" you time off, per se, but allows you time off if you need it to deal with what you describe. The employee would also need leave to draw from in order to actually "use" leave. In most places it would be your payroll/HR section that should be ultimately familar with how it works. Sorry, I digress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daventry Posted November 10, 2012 Report Share Posted November 10, 2012 As much as I would hate to see Tillman unable to play, I would support his decision if he felt he needed to be elsewhere. He has been nothing but pure class since he came to play for the Bears and just seems to get better as a player every year.....Peanut is one of my favourite Bears players! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemonej Posted November 10, 2012 Report Share Posted November 10, 2012 I empathize with Tillman because my first born was a daughter who was born with a heart defect that eventually recquired a pacemaker being implanted and her being with me for 9 years before passing away.So from my perspective I can't see Tillman deciding anything else. I was not there for my daughter's birth but left work immediately and arrived at the hospital to find my daughter in the ICU in an incubator with tubes and monitors attached. Since I was working in sales, chasing commissions was how I would prosper but at that time I could care less about money,it was about my daughter and her fight to stay alive and nothing else. 3 days after her birth she went into cardiac arrest but, was revived. I support Tillman's decision 100%.because I really understand his position. 2 other points I want to make about Florio's comments is first with these so called "involuntary workouts and OTAs" plus training camp and preseason games, the players have to be available for more than 16 days. The other point is that Tillman's wife is being induced 3 weeks early so his comments were more of a "what if" scenario. The doctors will be inducing her on Monday.You would think that Florio would have done his research before responding to a player's comments because in both articles he didn't mention anything about Tillman's experience with his 2nd daughter. I thought his backpedaling article was a bit lame making his first article seem like it was written to garner attention.This is not surprising since PFT over the years has always tried to create a buzz good or bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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