Props to Carimi

[Connorbear]

He could have pulled a Rachel and bailed on the team but he took his demotion like a man. Today he stepped into a position he had never played and held his own. Then after the game he said he was going to work hard to get his old job back.

 

I will be rooting for him.

 

Peace

[madlithuanian]

Agreed.

 

He made the best of his situation. Maybe he may be better suited for Guard?

 

He could have pulled a Rachel and bailed on the team but he took his demotion like a man. Today he stepped into a position he had never played and held his own. Then after the game he said he was going to work hard to get his old job back.

 

I will be rooting for him.

 

Peace

 

[Guest TerraTor]

Hes better suited to play the position he starred at in college, LT

[ASHKUM BEAR]

I'd like to give props to Webb also. Cutler was only sacked when Garza stepped on his foot and he fell. Great game by the line.

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

I'd like to give props to Webb also. Cutler was only sacked when Garza stepped on his foot and he fell. Great game by the line.

 

Considering he had Jared Allen over him for most of the game, not shabby. Even if he can't keep his shoe on. Maybe velcro closures.

[jason]

He could have pulled a Rachel and bailed on the team but he took his demotion like a man. Today he stepped into a position he had never played and held his own. Then after the game he said he was going to work hard to get his old job back.

 

I will be rooting for him.

 

Peace

 

Agreed. But it made me think, "If Carimi got demoted, WTF does Webb have to do to get demoted?"

 

As bad as Carimi has been, he's started sliding more in the past two or three games. Previous to that he wasn't horrible. Maybe average to just below average. Webb has been anywhere from atrocious to average just about the entire time he's been in a damn Chicago Bears uniform. (decent game today doesn't make up for countless games he has completely sucked)

[Connorbear]

Agreed. But it made me think, "If Carimi got demoted, WTF does Webb have to do to get demoted?"

 

As bad as Carimi has been, he's started sliding more in the past two or three games. Previous to that he wasn't horrible. Maybe average to just below average. Webb has been anywhere from atrocious to average just about the entire time he's been in a damn Chicago Bears uniform. (decent game today doesn't make up for countless games he has completely sucked)

The post was about Carimi. We've had plenty of posts blasting Webb and rightly so. I was trying to stay positive.

 

I am hoping Carimi can have a career comparible to Marc Columbo who ended up being a steady offensive lineman for years.

 

Peace

[rockren]

Considering he had Jared Allen over him for most of the game, not shabby. Even if he can't keep his shoe on. Maybe velcro closures.

 

For whatever reason Webb has done quite well against Allen....which is high praise against one of the best DEs around.

 

It is almost like a hitter v pitcher matchup in baseball...sometimes you just own a guy. While I don't feel Allen got owned (I don't know that he'll ever get owned) Webb certainly handled him today.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

The post was about Carimi. We've had plenty of posts blasting Webb and rightly so. I was trying to stay positive.

 

I am hoping Carimi can have a career comparible to Marc Columbo who ended up being a steady offensive lineman for years.

 

Peace

 

Think I heard about another player having the same problem. That being hurt last year enough to where that player couldn't really work out in the offseason enough to be where they should be for game shape. This I think is what is going on with Carimi. He seems smaller and weaker than the beginning of last year before he was injured. With his current size he looks more suited to being a Guard. I think all he needs is some more time to get some meat back on his bones and he'll look and play more like we are expecting. We may not see it this year but should by the beginning of next year. That being said maybe getting some time as a guard will be good for his development.

[Bears4Ever_34]

Hes better suited to play the position he starred at in college, LT

No he's not. Unless you want him to play even worse than he's played already. Carimi has been by far and away the worst pass blocker out of the entire group this year, and it's not really even close. He has ZERO lateral quickness and you want to play him at a position wear he can be exploited even more? Lord help us.

[balta1701-A]

For whatever reason Webb has done quite well against Allen....which is high praise against one of the best DEs around.

 

It is almost like a hitter v pitcher matchup in baseball...sometimes you just own a guy. While I don't feel Allen got owned (I don't know that he'll ever get owned) Webb certainly handled him today.

I kept saying the same thing until the last game last year, where Allen absolutely destroyed Webb and had like 5 sacks or something.

[GrizzlyBear]

Its totaly conceivable that Carimi is still weaker in that leg then before. Taking that into account I think him playing guard best suits his abililities right now. He has help to right in Scott and Garza to his left. It couldbe a blessing in disguise. If carimi is a natural at Guard then maybe put him next to Webb then you have Webb, Carimi Garza Louis and Scott. Thats a huge making run blocking a dominate force. To behonest that looks like a pretty good line for next year..

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

For whatever reason Webb has done quite well against Allen....which is high praise against one of the best DEs around.

 

It is almost like a hitter v pitcher matchup in baseball...sometimes you just own a guy. While I don't feel Allen got owned (I don't know that he'll ever get owned) Webb certainly handled him today.

Huh? Allen had 3.5 sacks the last time the teams played before Sunday.

[jason]

Its totaly conceivable that Carimi is still weaker in that leg then before. Taking that into account I think him playing guard best suits his abililities right now. He has help to right in Scott and Garza to his left. It couldbe a blessing in disguise. If carimi is a natural at Guard then maybe put him next to Webb then you have Webb, Carimi Garza Louis and Scott. Thats a huge making run blocking a dominate force. To behonest that looks like a pretty good line for next year..

 

All of what you said may be true, but doesn't it bother you that the Bears have drafted two NFL OTs, or at least had the original intention of using them there, and this concept would move both of them to OGs? Why not just wait longer in the draft and get OGs?

 

And the last sentence...c'mon man. Webb, Carimi, Garza, Louis, Scott is not a good OL. We're barely two weeks removed from one of the worst OL performances in Bear history, and you're already making that statement? Webb will not be good. Carimi would be in a new position. Garza would be the best of the bunch, but still not superb. Louis would be coming off of massive injury, and was never an all-star. And Scott is a virtual nobody who couldn't start over Carimi, who was on roller-skates for the last couple games or so.

[Chitownhustla]

He could have pulled a Rachel and bailed on the team but he took his demotion like a man. Today he stepped into a position he had never played and held his own. Then after the game he said he was going to work hard to get his old job back.

 

I will be rooting for him.

 

Peace

 

 

I agree!!! We need this first round pick to pan out somewhere on the Oline. I dont care which spot just somewhere!!!!

[GrizzlyBear]

All of what you said may be true, but doesn't it bother you that the Bears have drafted two NFL OTs, or at least had the original intention of using them there, and this concept would move both of them to OGs? Why not just wait longer in the draft and get OGs?

 

And the last sentence...c'mon man. Webb, Carimi, Garza, Louis, Scott is not a good OL. We're barely two weeks removed from one of the worst OL performances in Bear history, and you're already making that statement? Webb will not be good. Carimi would be in a new position. Garza would be the best of the bunch, but still not superb. Louis would be coming off of massive injury, and was never an all-star. And Scott is a virtual nobody who couldn't start over Carimi, who was on roller-skates for the last couple games or so.

 

Being your such expert at OL, Ill take your skeptic tone with a grain of salt. I said Looks to be pretty good. Not it is good. As for Carimi, His so called Roller skates is due to leg that is not up strength You should know being your expert on OL line play , that the base of tackle is the most important for a tackle. Tony Mandritch ring a bell.? Where did he end up playing for the Colts? It just appears your statements have a slightly personal tone to them. Maybe read the way I wrote it and not adlib what you think I wrote.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

All of what you said may be true, but doesn't it bother you that the Bears have drafted two NFL OTs, or at least had the original intention of using them there, and this concept would move both of them to OGs? Why not just wait longer in the draft and get OGs?

 

And the last sentence...c'mon man. Webb, Carimi, Garza, Louis, Scott is not a good OL. We're barely two weeks removed from one of the worst OL performances in Bear history, and you're already making that statement? Webb will not be good. Carimi would be in a new position. Garza would be the best of the bunch, but still not superb. Louis would be coming off of massive injury, and was never an all-star. And Scott is a virtual nobody who couldn't start over Carimi, who was on roller-skates for the last couple games or so.

 

I venture into this with some trepidation...but here goes. I think what GrizzlyBear was saying, all things considered, its not a bad line. It could be worse...Orlando Pace (the retreaded version), Levi Horn (?), John St Clair (not even good in the original form, let alone re-treaded) and Omiyale to name a few "experiments" that didn't work out.

 

And for the record, I looked at the lineup for the 2006 season (when the Bears last went to the Super Bowl) three of the 5 linemen then were FA acquisitions; Ruben Brown, Tait and Fred Miller. (Yes I know two of them were former 1st rounders, but picked by someone else).

 

Anyhow, getting back to what Grizz was addressing. Given where the Bears find themselves currently (and after losing two linemen in last weeks game, and another for his "own reasons") they are making do with what they have. Who knows, with Carimi at Guard maybe he will do better there? He certainly doesn't appear to be a Tackle right now...not with his technique and physique. Garza is getting long in tooth, but still a veteran. Webb...well there are too many issues to address but until he matures we may never see his full potential. And for what its worth he was paired up with Jared Allen last week...and held his own. To be fair, Scott isn't really a "nobody". He did start several games for the Steelers and aside from a few glitches in last weeks game, didn't look all that bad. And Louis could prove worth keeping, despite his bad injury. Does the team sign him to a multi-year contract? Probably not.

 

But given all this (and the ongoing issues the last few years) it is pretty evident the team needs to address the OLine. If for nothing else the reasons of what has transpired the last week and a half. How do they do it? Well that is where you and I differ. But I have conceded before that if the right OLman was available at #1 (weighted with everything else) then do it. I just don't want to be having another Carimi / Williams discussion this time next year.

[AZ54]

And for the record, I looked at the lineup for the 2006 season (when the Bears last went to the Super Bowl) three of the 5 l And Louis could prove worth keeping, despite his bad injury. Does the team sign him to a multi-year contract? Probably not.

 

Absolutely we sign him. Louis is starter material, still young, still improving. We can't afford to let him go we have to fix too many other holes on the line without adding to the problem.

[jason]

Being your such expert at OL, Ill take your skeptic tone with a grain of salt. I said Looks to be pretty good. Not it is good. As for Carimi, His so called Roller skates is due to leg that is not up strength You should know being your expert on OL line play , that the base of tackle is the most important for a tackle. Tony Mandritch ring a bell.? Where did he end up playing for the Colts? It just appears your statements have a slightly personal tone to them. Maybe read the way I wrote it and not adlib what you think I wrote.

 

The point about Carimi being on roller skates was that, even while injured, Scott didn't start over him. That generally means Scott is a worse player.

 

My comments are not intended to be personal at all. It's just that this is years and years in the making, and yet there are still people, apparently you are included, that think an OL of Webb, Carimi, Garza, Louis, Scott "looks like a pretty good line." Broken down that just doesn't make sense. Webb is at best subpar. Carimi would be in a brand new position (disregarding the fact that it would be a completely misplaced and wasted draft pick). Garza would still be an average center at best. Louis would be an average guard coming off a massive injury. And Scott is a nobody who couldn't start over Carimi when he was playing like garbage. How does that look "like a pretty good line"?

[jason]

I venture into this with some trepidation...but here goes. I think what GrizzlyBear was saying, all things considered, its not a bad line. It could be worse...Orlando Pace (the retreaded version), Levi Horn (?), John St Clair (not even good in the original form, let alone re-treaded) and Omiyale to name a few "experiments" that didn't work out.

 

And for the record, I looked at the lineup for the 2006 season (when the Bears last went to the Super Bowl) three of the 5 linemen then were FA acquisitions; Ruben Brown, Tait and Fred Miller. (Yes I know two of them were former 1st rounders, but picked by someone else).

 

Anyhow, getting back to what Grizz was addressing. Given where the Bears find themselves currently (and after losing two linemen in last weeks game, and another for his "own reasons") they are making do with what they have. Who knows, with Carimi at Guard maybe he will do better there? He certainly doesn't appear to be a Tackle right now...not with his technique and physique. Garza is getting long in tooth, but still a veteran. Webb...well there are too many issues to address but until he matures we may never see his full potential. And for what its worth he was paired up with Jared Allen last week...and held his own. To be fair, Scott isn't really a "nobody". He did start several games for the Steelers and aside from a few glitches in last weeks game, didn't look all that bad. And Louis could prove worth keeping, despite his bad injury. Does the team sign him to a multi-year contract? Probably not.

 

But given all this (and the ongoing issues the last few years) it is pretty evident the team needs to address the OLine. If for nothing else the reasons of what has transpired the last week and a half. How do they do it? Well that is where you and I differ. But I have conceded before that if the right OLman was available at #1 (with everything else) then do it. I just don't want to be having another Carimi / Williams discussion this time next year.

 

Trepidation is not necessary. Is Webb, Carimi, Garza, Louis, Scott the worst the Bears could do? Absolutely not. Does it "look like a pretty good line"? Hell no. But I guess if we're used to eating shit sandwiches, spoiled ham isn't too bad.

 

BTW - We don't necessarily disagree on how to build an OL. I just don't think the FA pieces are usually there. Tait was an anomaly, and if I recall a poison pill contract that KC couldn't match. Normally that guy is not available. Not with that many years left anyway. Brown in 2006 was lightning in a bottle. And Miller was at the tail end of his career, and I still can't believe the Bears squeezed three years out of him. Finding available vets who were once studs, and who can still play at a high level, is not something that is bankable for very long. When it works it's great, but you're pretty much always reloading every year because one of the guys doesn't work or one of the guys needs to retire. I prefer the draft because when you hit, there is a player on your team for a decade.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

Trepidation is not necessary. Is Webb, Carimi, Garza, Louis, Scott the worst the Bears could do? Absolutely not. Does it "look like a pretty good line"? Hell no. But I guess if we're used to eating shit sandwiches, spoiled ham isn't too bad.

 

BTW - We don't necessarily disagree on how to build an OL. I just don't think the FA pieces are usually there. Tait was an anomaly, and if I recall a poison pill contract that KC couldn't match. Normally that guy is not available. Not with that many years left anyway. Brown in 2006 was lightning in a bottle. And Miller was at the tail end of his career, and I still can't believe the Bears squeezed three years out of him. Finding available vets who were once studs, and who can still play at a high level, is not something that is bankable for very long. When it works it's great, but you're pretty much always reloading every year because one of the guys doesn't work or one of the guys needs to retire. I prefer the draft because when you hit, there is a player on your team for a decade.

 

"One man's garbage is another man's treasure" . I'm thinking (hoping) Gurode is one of those players for the Bears. Not the Orlando Pace version that didn't work out. And, as I said before I feel that Scott will pan out better than expected. He has had time as a starter with the Steelers, so there is that.

 

Now the other side of the discussion is about drafting. You're aware of my stance and going with my original remark of "garbage" vs "treasure" I'm just leery when you see players like Colombo (in this case our garbage, someone else's treasure) and Williams - and maybe Carimi (who were high draft picks) not work out, then I tend to look towards the FA avenue. But like I said, hoping that the draft will work out.

[lemonej]

Here's my 2 cents on the weekly( sometimes daily) O-line debate.

 

The 49er game was an indictment of this unit(talentwise) and the lack of strength in both OTs. Both were being "outpunched" by DE/LBs that they had a size advantage on.

The Viking game it was telestrated by the analyst that Lance Louis was being pulled on almost all the running plays and that if the Vikings wanted to know where the ball was going to key Louis.As soon as that was said Tice changed up and used Scott to lead on a running play.So it looked like the plan was to run at the Vikings premier pass rusher on running plays and max protect and get rid of the ball quickly on pass plays. The problem is that this should be the plan every week.Going forward I'm not sure that Carimi at OG is the guy who can be athletic enough to do that. Against the 9ers why was Jason Campbell holding the ball so long? He checked down against the Texans 3/4 scheme ,why not against the 9ers 3/4 scheme?This whole thing about Tice being a first year OC is starting to get old. He played several years in the league and has been an OL coach and Head Coach, so I'm not buying that inexperience garbage that gets spewed over the airwaves every week. This is a former TE(Like Ditka) who should know how to exploit a defense.

 

So here is a few things to consider when it comes to evaluating this OL and Offense as a whole:

 

The OL and OC is Mike Tice

 

Both young OTs and your young starting OG was scouted and approved by Tice as well as all the veterans and players brought in to compete for spots and depth..

 

Watching the Jacksonville OL that supposedly was developed by Tice against our D was also an indictment.

 

Follow up the script of the Viking game with 39 more rush attempts every week and give the OL a chance to attack the defense.There is a lot of money invested in 2 backs but between them they only have a little over 1000 yards.

 

Is it me or does it seem no matter who the OC is Cutler holds the ball until he gets clocked(concussed) and then decides to start getting rid of it a little quicker? Then also it's determined that he needs to throw more on the move to minimize the pass rush.That was the same scenario last year under the previous OC.

[balta1701-A]

Kevin Seifert and some scouts takes on Carimi.

"He is simply awful in protection," said Matt Williamson of Scouts Inc. "He gets beat with power, speed, you name it."

 

Sometimes a below-average pass-blocker can be protected if he moves to guard, but Williamson suggested that Carimi's 6-foot-7 frame could be a hindrance there.

 

"Being so tall on the interior is really tough when trying to get leverage against B.J. Raji/Vince Wilfork types," Williamson said. "If/when he plays high, NFL defensive tackles are going to totally walk him deep into the pocket. And now that liability is even closer to the quarterback than when he was at right tackle."

 

Carimi is expected to start at right guard Sunday against the Seattle Seahawks, mostly because the Bears' options are limited. Two guards who have started games this season, Lance Louis and Chilo Rachal, won't play again in 2012. A third, Chris Spencer, has a knee injury that could sideline him for a week or two.

 

In the long-term, however, the Bears must decide whether a poor 10-game stretch is enough to render final judgment on a former first-round draft pick who has made a total of 12 NFL starts. My guess is Carimi will get another chance, especially considering how well he has blocked for the run.

 

Williamson said Carimi has been "an excellent run-blocker" and thus should still be considered a prospect with "starting right tackle abilities." PFF rates him third among all NFL tackles in run-blocking. As a right tackle in a run-based offense, Carimi doesn't have to be an elite pass-blocker. But he does need to be much better than he was this season.

[madlithuanian]

Thanks for sharing that. Sadly, it doesn't bode too well...

 

Kevin Seifert and some scouts takes on Carimi.

 

[Mongo3451]

Thanks for sharing that. Sadly, it doesn't bode too well...

 

That's not how I read it. 3rd worst pass blocker and 3rd best run blocker. Give him another year to get his body right and the pass blocking will be better. Give the kid time.