As the Bears Gm I-----

[scs787]

We have to resign Scott, he is not under contract. So we need to sign him, Actually Beatty is rated lower than Webb on one site I looked at and think we can do better. I think we should go after Bushrod/NO which will be more money but not Jake Long money. Then we need to sign a LG in FAgency, trusting a rookie to be consistent quality might be asking to much.

 

 

Funny you should say that as the site I was looking at PFF, which is the site Emery uses, has Bushrod as the 8th worst in pass block efficiency whereas Beatty ranked 11th best.....I don't pay for PFF so the stats I'm looking at are only through the first half of the season but it's hard to believe the flip flopped that much.

 

 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/...ensive-tackles/

 

I just figured Scott would be back after reading a previous poster say Scott will be the starting RT.

[Stinger226]

Funny you should say that as the site I was looking at PFF, which is the site Emery uses, has Bushrod as the 8th worst in pass block efficiency whereas Beatty ranked 11th best.....I don't pay for PFF so the stats I'm looking at are only through the first half of the season but it's hard to believe the flip flopped that much.

 

 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/...ensive-tackles/

 

I just figured Scott would be back after reading a previous poster say Scott will be the starting RT.

Actually that was a different site, I think it was NFL Trade Rumors, I visited so many today, I would have to verify that.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

Sign Branden Albert, Kory Lichtensteiger and Brian Hartline.

Keep Melton, Scott, Louis, Hayden, Roach, Hayes, Spencer, Anderson, and McCown.

Release Hester, Davis, Carimi, and Spaeth.

Restructure Tillman and Peppers.

Extend Jennings and Marshall.

 

Trade down

2. Kevin Minter, MLB, LSU

--Urlacher's replacement

2. Zach Ertz, TE, Stanford

--Pass catcher, smart, can block. Opposite of Kellen Davis.

3. Brennan Williams, T, North Carolina

--Nice shot of youth and depth to have on an OL.

4. Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU

--Bears need a nickel and a PR. Why not?

5. Mario Benavides, C, Louisville

--Played well against very athletic UF in the Sugar Bowl.

6. Marcus Lattimore, RB, South Carolina

--A player of this caliber in the 6th round? Can't hurt.

7. Marquess Wilson, WR, Washington State

--Labeled a quitter for hating Mike Leach, but he might've been a 3rd round pick had he not left Wazzu.

[Stinger226]

Sign Branden Albert, Kory Lichtensteiger and Brian Hartline.

Keep Melton, Scott, Louis, Hayden, Roach, Hayes, Spencer, Anderson, and McCown.

Release Hester, Davis, Carimi, and Spaeth.

Restructure Tillman and Peppers.

Extend Jennings and Marshall.

 

Trade down

2. Kevin Minter, MLB, LSU

--Urlacher's replacement

2. Zach Ertz, TE, Stanford

--Pass catcher, smart, can block. Opposite of Kellen Davis.

3. Brennan Williams, T, North Carolina

--Nice shot of youth and depth to have on an OL.

4. Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU

--Bears need a nickel and a PR. Why not?

5. Mario Benavides, C, Louisville

--Played well against very athletic UF in the Sugar Bowl.

6. Marcus Lattimore, RB, South Carolina

--A player of this caliber in the 6th round? Can't hurt.

7. Marquess Wilson, WR, Washington State

--Labeled a quitter for hating Mike Leach, but he might've been a 3rd round pick had he not left Wazzu.

I like all that, the only thing I question is having enough money to resign Melton and pickup 3 FAgents. Melton will want a big pay check and that limits the other choices.

[jason]

Sign Branden Albert, Kory Lichtensteiger and Brian Hartline.

Keep Melton, Scott, Louis, Hayden, Roach, Hayes, Spencer, Anderson, and McCown.

Release Hester, Davis, Carimi, and Spaeth.

Restructure Tillman and Peppers.

Extend Jennings and Marshall.

 

Trade down

2. Kevin Minter, MLB, LSU

--Urlacher's replacement

2. Zach Ertz, TE, Stanford

--Pass catcher, smart, can block. Opposite of Kellen Davis.

3. Brennan Williams, T, North Carolina

--Nice shot of youth and depth to have on an OL.

4. Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU

--Bears need a nickel and a PR. Why not?

5. Mario Benavides, C, Louisville

--Played well against very athletic UF in the Sugar Bowl.

6. Marcus Lattimore, RB, South Carolina

--A player of this caliber in the 6th round? Can't hurt.

7. Marquess Wilson, WR, Washington State

--Labeled a quitter for hating Mike Leach, but he might've been a 3rd round pick had he not left Wazzu.

 

I hate the idea of releasing Carimi. That's crazy. And a draft that starts out MLB, then TE, would make me puke. But I do like the rest of your draft, particularly the chances taken on talented but troubled players (4th, 6th, 7th). If the Bears had done that last year, like I wanted, they'd already have a starting LB in Burfict, and maybe the successor to Urlacher.

[jason]

I understand where ur coming from. Personally i don't think Chris Williams was ever given a real chance. He was at LT then got hurt. When he came back he was LG then bounced around from there. We cant expect rookies to be great from day 1 and if hes not start moving them all around. This hardly ever works in general. If we draft a LG let's have him play there. More than anything we need continuity on the oline but when we continue to bounce everyone around we will never get that. I know it has really killed us last couple yrs with injuries up and down the line. Im not making excuses for any of the OL. Just saying in general of course.

 

QFT.

 

Tice and the coaching staff completely screwed Williams, and thus far Carimi has been tossed around like a $2 hooker.

 

If a player was a stud in college at position X, draft him to play position X. It's not that difficult. As I've said before, going into training camp next year, the LT job should be Carimi's by default, and to lose the job he'd have to be atrocious. If he's just plain bad or subpar, no problem because that's about the same as Webb. May as well try to invest time and reps into your LT of the future instead of trying the Webb experiment for the fourth(?) straight year. While we're at it, let's move Garza back to his actual position of OG, and sign/draft a Center. Enough of this flip-flop garbage.

[bowlingtwig]

QFT.

 

Tice and the coaching staff completely screwed Williams, and thus far Carimi has been tossed around like a $2 hooker.

 

If a player was a stud in college at position X, draft him to play position X. It's not that difficult. As I've said before, going into training camp next year, the LT job should be Carimi's by default, and to lose the job he'd have to be atrocious. If he's just plain bad or subpar, no problem because that's about the same as Webb. May as well try to invest time and reps into your LT of the future instead of trying the Webb experiment for the fourth(?) straight year. While we're at it, let's move Garza back to his actual position of OG, and sign/draft a Center. Enough of this flip-flop garbage.

Thank u. Finally someone who sees my point of view. I say draft barrett jones. Hes a C that then allows us to move garza back to his original position

[scs787]

QFT.

 

Tice and the coaching staff completely screwed Williams, and thus far Carimi has been tossed around like a $2 hooker.

 

If a player was a stud in college at position X, draft him to play position X. It's not that difficult. As I've said before, going into training camp next year, the LT job should be Carimi's by default, and to lose the job he'd have to be atrocious. If he's just plain bad or subpar, no problem because that's about the same as Webb. May as well try to invest time and reps into your LT of the future instead of trying the Webb experiment for the fourth(?) straight year. While we're at it, let's move Garza back to his actual position of OG, and sign/draft a Center. Enough of this flip-flop garbage.

 

That's a pretty sketchy move in my opinion but it could work. Problem is if it fails then we're stuck with another garbage line for a year and could end up in the same situation we are this year, next year (Needing that franchise LT while, speculating where Carimi plays).

 

From Mike Mayok

 

"I think he’s the kind of guy ... you try ... at left tackle, and if he can’t handle the speed out there, you’ve got an all-pro right tackle."

 

So it's not outlandish to move him from LT to RT...Though I can agree he's never been given a shot at LT.

 

Oh I don't think you'll find a person outside of Mike Tice who wants to see the 4th year of the Webb experiment...We all want a proven guy their, and this is the year to get one.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

I like all that, the only thing I question is having enough money to resign Melton and pickup 3 FAgents. Melton will want a big pay check and that limits the other choices.

Albert is a $12m/year guy, and Hartline and Lichtensteiger $3m/year guys. That's only $18m. If you cut Hester and restructure the 2 I said and extend the other 2, you free up a lot of cap room. Plus, Stein is a genius. He added a lot of guys last year with the help of signing bonuses and guarantees when everyone thought they only had half the cap room.

 

I hate the idea of releasing Carimi. That's crazy. And a draft that starts out MLB, then TE, would make me puke. But I do like the rest of your draft, particularly the chances taken on talented but troubled players (4th, 6th, 7th). If the Bears had done that last year, like I wanted, they'd already have a starting LB in Burfict, and maybe the successor to Urlacher.

It's simply an idea. He was awful last year. His knee is still shot after suffering what was supposed to be a 4-6 week injury. Plus, Carimi was an Angelo guy. Emery has no connection to him. All in all, I think it's a decision he'll make, not particularly what I want to see done.

 

BTW, if you cut Davis and Spaeth, a TE in the 2nd would be necessary, as would a MLB if you let Urlacher walk, unless you trust Roach. If they sign Albert and Lichtensteiger as well as keep Scott & Spencer, an OL isn't a need anymore in round 1 or 2.

[bowlingtwig]

Albert is a $12m/year guy, and Hartline and Lichtensteiger $3m/year guys. That's only $18m. If you cut Hester and restructure the 2 I said and extend the other 2, you free up a lot of cap room. Plus, Stein is a genius. He added a lot of guys last year with the help of signing bonuses and guarantees when everyone thought they only had half the cap room.

 

 

It's simply an idea. He was awful last year. His knee is still shot after suffering what was supposed to be a 4-6 week injury. Plus, Carimi was an Angelo guy. Emery has no connection to him. All in all, I think it's a decision he'll make, not particularly what I want to see done.

 

BTW, if you cut Davis and Spaeth, a TE in the 2nd would be necessary, as would a MLB if you let Urlacher walk, unless you trust Roach. If they sign Albert and Lichtensteiger as well as keep Scott & Spencer, an OL isn't a need anymore in round 1 or 2.

I could be off a little but i didn't know u could restructure a guy on the last yr of his deal. Talking Tillman here. Also keep in mind Wooten hit several escalators in his contract giving him base of $1.308M nxt yr instead of the $575,000 he was supposed to make. I hate the idea of restructuring peppers. If u restructure sure he will have a lower cap hit in 2013 but then even higher cap hits in 2014 and 2015. That's how u get in cap hell. Ask Pittsburgh who has done this with several guys and now there screwed with big ben having cap hots near 20M for remaininf on his deal

[Stinger226]

QFT.

 

Tice and the coaching staff completely screwed Williams, and thus far Carimi has been tossed around like a $2 hooker.

 

If a player was a stud in college at position X, draft him to play position X. It's not that difficult. As I've said before, going into training camp next year, the LT job should be Carimi's by default, and to lose the job he'd have to be atrocious. If he's just plain bad or subpar, no problem because that's about the same as Webb. May as well try to invest time and reps into your LT of the future instead of trying the Webb experiment for the fourth(?) straight year. While we're at it, let's move Garza back to his actual position of OG, and sign/draft a Center. Enough of this flip-flop garbage.

Teams change players positions all the time, you cant fault a coaching staff trying to put a player in the best position to be successful. Williams wasnt any good, how much playing time did he do after he left? If your a good player you play, not get shifted around because you cant do the job. He sucked. Garza will be the center until he is replaced.

[Stinger226]

Albert is a $12m/year guy, and Hartline and Lichtensteiger $3m/year guys. That's only $18m. If you cut Hester and restructure the 2 I said and extend the other 2, you free up a lot of cap room. Plus, Stein is a genius. He added a lot of guys last year with the help of signing bonuses and guarantees when everyone thought they only had half the cap room.

 

 

It's simply an idea. He was awful last year. His knee is still shot after suffering what was supposed to be a 4-6 week injury. Plus, Carimi was an Angelo guy. Emery has no connection to him. All in all, I think it's a decision he'll make, not particularly what I want to see done.

 

BTW, if you cut Davis and Spaeth, a TE in the 2nd would be necessary, as would a MLB if you let Urlacher walk, unless you trust Roach. If they sign Albert and Lichtensteiger as well as keep Scott & Spencer, an OL isn't a need anymore in round 1 or 2.

What do you think Melton will be paid? He thinks he is the best in the league and wants to 10 mil range. So I would say he will at least get 5-6. that blows that 18m you just tried to get your 3 FAs with. We have lots of spots to fill, and even if they come cheap, that will add to the burden.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

What do you think Melton will be paid? He thinks he is the best in the league and wants to 10 mil range. So I would say he will at least get 5-6. that blows that 18m you just tried to get your 3 FAs with. We have lots of spots to fill, and even if they come cheap, that will add to the burden.

If Melton gets $5-$6m/year, how does that blow $18m?

[Stinger226]

If Melton gets $5-$6m/year, how does that blow $18m?

the money has to come from somewhere. If we have 18 mil cap space, subtract our guys we resign and then what do you have to sign FAgents. Everybody thinks we have unlimited funds to sign anybody, realistically we just dont.

[jason]

Pretty sure he looked A LOT better at RG over RT though so whether he played there before is not an issue.

 

It kind of does matter since he was a LT coming out of college. He played there for four straight years.

 

To him, RT may as well have been RG. Sure, RT is more closely related to LT than RG is, but ultimately blocking is blocking. He should have been put at LT to begin with.

[jason]

So it's not outlandish to move him [Carimi] from LT to RT...Though I can agree he's never been given a shot at LT.

 

It's not outlandish, but when a guy plays a position for four straight dominating years in a big time football college, you should probably draft him for that position.

[jason]

BTW, if you cut Davis and Spaeth, a TE in the 2nd would be necessary

 

No it is not. Essentially you're replacing nothing, since both guys sucked. If you want to replace the fictitious pass-catching abilities of Davis, you give the job to the TE on the roster: Rodriguez. You know, the guy drafted to be a pass-catching TE. If you're replacing the supposedly great blocking abilities of Spaeth, you pick that up in the 6th or 7th round, because pass-blocking TEs are not players on which you waste high draft picks.

 

 

[jason]

Teams change players positions all the time, you cant fault a coaching staff trying to put a player in the best position to be successful. Williams wasnt any good, how much playing time did he do after he left? If your a good player you play, not get shifted around because you cant do the job. He sucked. Garza will be the center until he is replaced.

 

Teams do, the Bears seem to do it more often. And it's almost always unsuccessful.

 

As for Williams, he was never given a fair shake at LT. This has been documented over and over and over on this board.

 

Finally, the concept of "you're good, you won't get shifted" is completely false. Williams was moved specifically because he WAS good, and the Bears needed help elsewhere on the OL.

[scs787]

It kind of does matter since he was a LT coming out of college. He played there for four straight years.

 

To him, RT may as well have been RG. Sure, RT is more closely related to LT than RG is, but ultimately blocking is blocking. He should have been put at LT to begin with.

 

 

You don't think he was given a shot at LT in training camp and the Bears just did exactly what the Mayock quote I posted said?

[bowlingtwig]

You don't think he was given a shot at LT in training camp and the Bears just did exactly what the Mayock quote I posted said?

I certainly recall lovie and company saying they drafted him to be the RT of the futur. That tells me they didnt try him at LT

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

No it is not. Essentially you're replacing nothing, since both guys sucked. If you want to replace the fictitious pass-catching abilities of Davis, you give the job to the TE on the roster: Rodriguez. You know, the guy drafted to be a pass-catching TE. If you're replacing the supposedly great blocking abilities of Spaeth, you pick that up in the 6th or 7th round, because pass-blocking TEs are not players on which you waste high draft picks.

Rodriguez is 6'2. He's not going to be a tough match-up for anyone. He's an H-Back, or a FB.

[balta1701-A]

I certainly recall lovie and company saying they drafted him to be the RT of the futur. That tells me they didnt try him at LT

I agree with this, but I'm also not sure it's a mistake. If Carimi was thought to be an above average run blocker who would have to survive as a pass blocker (which conveniently is sorta what we saw from him this year, except for the failure to survive as a pass blocker) then they might well have slated him for RT out of the gates, since you don't want weak pass blocking on your QB's blind side.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

the money has to come from somewhere. If we have 18 mil cap space, subtract our guys we resign and then what do you have to sign FAgents. Everybody thinks we have unlimited funds to sign anybody, realistically we just dont.

Nobody said unlimited funds. It's become publicly known the Bears will have a lot of money to spend come March. Melton, Albert, Lichtensteiger, Hartline, and a few of their own FA's isn't out of the question.

[scs787]

I agree with this, but I'm also not sure it's a mistake. If Carimi was thought to be an above average run blocker who would have to survive as a pass blocker (which conveniently is sorta what we saw from him this year, except for the failure to survive as a pass blocker) then they might well have slated him for RT out of the gates, since you don't want weak pass blocking on your QB's blind side.

 

 

Ya my post about him getting a shot at LT in training camp may be wrong but Balta is right here. After looking at some of his scouting reports I literally can not find a report that projects him as a LT.

 

FFtoolbox.com

However, he may not be a true left tackle in the NFL which could ultimately hurt his overall stock. In all likelihood, he will be drafted as a right tackle with the potential to move to the left side later in his career. ...... Right now, he's a big liability at left tackle but could eventually be a career pro at either spot if he's given the right coaching. This is an optimistic point of view as many will see him as a pure right tackle in the NFL.

 

Walterfootball....not sure when this is from with the "Next year comment"

Carimi will play in the NFL for some team and start at right tackle. He is by no means a left tackle and I will be shocked if he is drafted in the first round next year. Carimi has size and he is a powerful run blocker, but lacks the athleticism, technique and consistency for him to be even discussed as a first-round talent.....Player Comparison: Jeremy Trueblood: Trueblood and Carimi both have similar body types and are punishing run blockers. However, Trueblood is just a solid starter at right tackle for Tampa Bay, and I think that is the most we can hope for out of Carimi in the NFL.

 

Newerascouting

Final word: Being the guy who had to follow Joe Thomas at Wisconsin was a daunting task. Carimi, while nowhere near as good as Thomas, has done well. He’s a power tackle best suited for the right side of the line. Carimi struggles some against speed rushers, but has good strength to anchor and seal.

 

Draftbreakdown

The consensus around the draft community is that he will ultimately be a right tackle in the NFL. While that could be the case, I may be in the minority in thinking he can play left tackle at the next level if he improves his footwork and his anchor strength

 

I think he was successful at LT in college because UW was a power running team and thats what Gabe excels at, the run game.

 

After reading all that, and with the knowledge now that Scott is a free agent, I wanna see Gabe given 1 more shot at RT to prove to us if he was indeed hurt.

 

After watching the Nat'l Title game count me in on one of the Bama OL in the first.

 

Carimi/Louis/Jones/Garza/Top LT FA or Carimi/Louis/Garza/Jones/LT or Carimi/Louis/Garza/Warmack/LT

[Mongo3451]

Rodriguez is 6'2. He's not going to be a tough match-up for anyone. He's an H-Back, or a FB.

 

He's a Dallas Clark clone. Clark is listed at 6'3, but I can guarantee he's 6'1. He was a beast for years at TE.