scs787 Posted January 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 I saw the same things. I am hoping the former is just Emery not wanting to talk negatively about one of his players in public. I believe the latter to be flawed analysis, which is understandable because pretty much any analysis like this is going to be subjective. I'm not sure Phil has said anything about it, I'm just saying that the site he uses for an unbiased opinion on his players says that Webb is an average player. While the analysis may be flawed it's what our GM uses so it is what I'll be using to back arguments. I still would like something better than "average" at LT which is why I'm still calling for a LT in FA if one of the 6 guys I listed becomes available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 If they sign Clady, keep Urlacher, and Warmack is there at 20, what do you want them to do? If we signed Clady and Warmack was there at 20, my life would be complete. It would make losing Urlacher painless... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TerraTor Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 If they sign Clady, keep Urlacher, and Warmack is there at 20, what do you want them to do? Best LB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TerraTor Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 If we signed Clady and Warmack was there at 20, my life would be complete. It would make losing Urlacher painless... Shayne Skov in the 2nd then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Do you not realize that is how the majority of teams get their franchise LTs? I mean, how else can this picture be painted? It is very rare for a franchise LT to leave his team because they are such a rare commodity. That's why they're not in FA every year. Upside of a FA LT (who is not a franchise LT): Pretty good for a few years Downside of a FA LT (non-franchise): Wasted big contract, attention required every few years regardless of outcome Upside of RD1 LT: Franchise, decade-long bookend, problem fixed fairly permanently Downside of RD1 LT: Bust. Attention required every few years once draft pick is determined to be a bust There is no doubt you and I have a discord on this and oddly enough I agree moreso with TT on his outlook (although earlier he forgot the other potential bust in Carimi). You make valid points on what you outlined above (Pros and Cons) but like we have discussed before the risk for picking that "decades long bookend LT" is just that, a risk. I still think that the first round should always be a skill set player or value pick. If one of the top three rated Tackles is still available at 20 when the Bears pick then that, I would consider, is a value pick. And in case you're wondering no I don't think the Bears are in a desperate enough situation to trade up to a higher pick to get that top three talent. Conversely, if a highly touted FA is available (like there apparently will be this year) you dump as much money as you can to get that player. Again the reason being here is that the player is "proven" instead of unknown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 If they sign Clady, keep Urlacher, and Warmack is there at 20, what do you want them to do? It's a no brainer. You pick Warmack, Cutler has priapism from sheer happiness, you pick Garza's replacement in the 4th or 5th (great year for Centers - I think it was Schwartzstein who looked good yesterday), and you focus elsewhere (i.e. BPA) in the 2nd round. Of course, if I had my way and Barrett Jones fell to them in the 2nd, they pick OL again and finally solve the problem. Clady - Garza - Jones - Louis - Carimi (That's nasty. All offensive skill positions immediately upgraded.) Realistically, however... 1. Warmack 2. Ertz/Eifert, whoever falls (I wouldn't like the pick, but I know many would) 4. BPA @ LB or DE 5. BPA @ C 6. BPA 7. BPA That'd be a pretty great scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 There is no doubt you and I have a discord on this and oddly enough I agree moreso with TT on his outlook (although earlier he forgot the other potential bust in Carimi). You make valid points on what you outlined above (Pros and Cons) but like we have discussed before the risk for picking that "decades long bookend LT" is just that, a risk. I still think that the first round should always be a skill set player or value pick. If one of the top three rated Tackles is still available at 20 when the Bears pick then that, I would consider, is a value pick. And in case you're wondering no I don't think the Bears are in a desperate enough situation to trade up to a higher pick to get that top three talent. Conversely, if a highly touted FA is available (like there apparently will be this year) you dump as much money as you can to get that player. Again the reason being here is that the player is "proven" instead of unknown. I agree it's a risk. But you have to take risks to get big rewards. This year's crop of guys who will apparently be available is VERY uncommon. Normally it's more of a quick-fix situation where there is a short shelf-life and still a certain amount of risk. Having said all that, if the Bears don't make signing one of the big name LTs the absolute first priority, then it will be yet another ridiculous oversight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Jermon Bushrod +1.5 -Probably a goner I'd prefer a LT in free agency or honestly Webb again. I guess the past drafting of Williams and Carimi has scared me away from the draft. I like this list and see good potential out of it. From what I read one of the only redeeming qualities new OC Kromer brings to the team is his connection to Bushrod while at New Orleans, so maybe that could be enough for an enticement? And I totally agree on the past of drafting in the first for LT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balta1701-A Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 I agree it's a risk. But you have to take risks to get big rewards. This year's crop of guys who will apparently be available is VERY uncommon. Normally it's more of a quick-fix situation where there is a short shelf-life and still a certain amount of risk. Having said all that, if the Bears don't make signing one of the big name LTs the absolute first priority, then it will be yet another ridiculous oversight. Isn't it the case though that looking at the available guys in January is very, very different from looking at the available guys in March? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scs787 Posted January 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Lewan and Matthews deciding to stay in school really threw a wrench into the draft a LT decision for me...With them gone the LT crop dried up. Had they both stayed in the draft I THINK I would have been game to draft a LT in the draft. Like I keep saying though, now past Joeckel and Fisher you don't have that immediate impact player at LT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scs787 Posted January 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Isn't it the case though that looking at the available guys in January is very, very different from looking at the available guys in March? There is a chance they will all be resigned...In which case I'd rather just give Webb another shot in system that doesn't leave him on an island 9 times outta 10. I just don't have faith in the guys past Fisher an Joeckel to contribute right away. Seeing what the line will do different will be interesting, gotta expect some kind of change in the scheme.....I wonder what Marc did in Canada to get the same guys that gave up 68 sacks a year before to only give up 22. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Mayock mentioned today that as of now 5 OL could go top 10 including Johnson and warmack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Of course, if I had my way and Barrett Jones fell to them in the 2nd, they pick OL again and finally solve the problem. Clady - Garza - Jones - Louis - Carimi (That's nasty. All offensive skill positions immediately upgraded.) Love it! But you forgot Warmack. Unless Carimi fully recovers and gets his size, strength and quickness back, you gotta put Scott there. Unfortunately, if he can't, he's gotta go and Webb would be the backup in grooming. Clady-Warmack-Jones-Garza(while Louis heals)-Carimi/Scott/Webb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 It's a no brainer. You pick Warmack, Cutler has priapism from sheer happiness, you pick Garza's replacement in the 4th or 5th (great year for Centers - I think it was Schwartzstein who looked good yesterday), and you focus elsewhere (i.e. BPA) in the 2nd round. Of course, if I had my way and Barrett Jones fell to them in the 2nd, they pick OL again and finally solve the problem. Clady - Garza - Jones - Louis - Carimi (That's nasty. All offensive skill positions immediately upgraded.) Realistically, however... 1. Warmack 2. Ertz/Eifert, whoever falls (I wouldn't like the pick, but I know many would) 4. BPA @ LB or DE 5. BPA @ C 6. BPA 7. BPA That'd be a pretty great scenario. Your smart so why do project a 7th rounder when we don't have , get up to date Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 There is no doubt you and I have a discord on this and oddly enough I agree moreso with TT on his outlook (although earlier he forgot the other potential bust in Carimi). You make valid points on what you outlined above (Pros and Cons) but like we have discussed before the risk for picking that "decades long bookend LT" is just that, a risk. I still think that the first round should always be a skill set player or value pick. If one of the top three rated Tackles is still available at 20 when the Bears pick then that, I would consider, is a value pick. And in case you're wondering no I don't think the Bears are in a desperate enough situation to trade up to a higher pick to get that top three talent. Conversely, if a highly touted FA is available (like there apparently will be this year) you dump as much money as you can to get that player. Again the reason being here is that the player is "proven" instead of unknown. Most of the good LTs will get franchise tags, but the one we might be able to get is Bushrod. NO is got bigtime cap issues and won't be able to tag him. His rating was low due to some injury issues, check out his whole career, you will see he is a good player. I think we go after him, he won't break the bank. Then we still need to draft a couple OL this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scs787 Posted January 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Mayock mentioned today that as of now 5 OL could go top 10 including Johnson and warmack Really now? Who's the 5th? Cooper? Jones?....While ones man opinion on a draft that no one can correctly guess should be taken with a grain of salt that should be another reason why we take a LT in FA if one is available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Really now? Who's the 5th? Cooper? Jones?....While ones man opinion on a draft that no one can correctly guess should be taken with a grain of salt that should be another reason why we take a LT in FA if one is available. Just double checked it was nfl draft Bible that said it. Mentioned joeckle, johnson, flucker, warmack and eric fisher. And i never said its fact. Im just passing on info that could impact us. Nothing more nothing less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scs787 Posted January 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Just double checked it was nfl draft Bible that said it. Mentioned joeckle, johnson, flucker, warmack and eric fisher. And i never said its fact. Im just passing on info that could impact us. Nothing more nothing less. Oh I know, I'm not accusing you of this. Ah yes Fluker, forgot about him. Saying this can go either way, either "There are 5 top 10 talent guys" or "There won't be shit there at 20 so we better grab a LT in FA"....Is it worth the risk not grabbing a LT in FA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Oh I know, I'm not accusing you of this. Ah yes Fluker, forgot about him. Saying this can go either way, either "There are 5 top 10 talent guys" or "There won't be shit there at 20 so we better grab a LT in FA"....Is it worth the risk not grabbing a LT in FA? Honestly i think we will see a record # of OL go in 1st rd because i don't see the top end talent at qb, rb and wr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scs787 Posted January 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Honestly i think we will see a record # of OL go in 1st rd because i don't see the top end talent at qb, rb and wr Well luckily we don't need any of those 3. OLB or TE is the way to go IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Honestly i think we will see a record # of OL go in 1st rd because i don't see the top end talent at qb, rb and wr What makes you say that? Just because there is no consensus #1 at the skill positions? Actually, there is better chance that more defensive players go in the first round than offensive players (including OLine). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Well luckily we don't need any of those 3. OLB or TE is the way to go IMO. Could hurt us though as other teams in front of us also need OL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 What makes you say that? Just because there is no consensus #1 at the skill positions? Actually, there is better chance that more defensive players go in the first round than offensive players (including OLine). Call it gut feeling at this point. U could be right about the defensive players but i still think we could see 6-7 OL go in 1st Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balta1701-A Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Could hurt us though as other teams in front of us also need OL I haven't seen an update recently, but the last I saw was that the early run was going to be on DE's, this was going to be a big draft on outside pass rushers. If there's an early run on OT's, then DE's could be a bargain late in the first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 I haven't seen an update recently, but the last I saw was that the early run was going to be on DE's, this was going to be a big draft on outside pass rushers. If there's an early run on OT's, then DE's could be a bargain late in the first. If DE comes to us i can't see us going that route with so many other needs. I personally don't know about an early run on OL but do think 6-7 will go in 1st overall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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