If they move on....

[scs787]

I'm still not sold that they will move on from Jay, for better or for worse, but just to get the loss off my mind for a little bit, lets say Jay is let go and they give Josh like 3M to compete with a rookie here is what my ideal offseason would look like....

 

Bears will have the 4th most cap room of any team in the league, and with a Championship caliber offense, Chicago should be an inviting place for FAs to sign. Assuming they cut Peppers they will have 50M in cap space.

 

Resign

 

Tillman 5M

Jennings 5M

Melton 3M prove it deal

Collins 1M

Ratliff 1M

Wootton 3M

Bowman 2M

Williams 1.5M

Slausson 2M

Gould 4.5M

McCown 3M

 

 

Total 31M

 

Sign

 

Michael Bennett 5M

Jarius Byrd 8M

 

Total 13M

Grand Total 44M

 

Don't know how much cap you need for the draft but 6M should be enough,and then there are other moves that can be made to make room to fill out the roster.

Draft

 

1R- Ra'Shede Hageman DT Minny- I've been a big supporter of Paea over the years, but I think the DL can use more girth vs Paea's strength. With his big body and freakishly long arms I think he'd help the run defense big time.

 

2R- A.J. McCarron QB Bama- Or really whatever QB Trestman likes the most, with the plethora of depth at the QB position in the draft there's bound to be someone who slips to the Bears in the 2R. I've been against McCarron in the past, calling him a product of the system, but thinking about it, what we have here is indeed a system. Our receivers are so big and almost always out match the opposing DBs, so it's just like what he sees at Bama. There may be better options that drop but if not I'm cool with A.J..

 

3R- Best safety available- I'm ready to give COnte and Wright the boot.

 

4R- Best center available- Ready to move on from Garza and let Kromer work his magic.

 

5R- Best CB available- A prospect to groom behind Tillman/Jennings/Bowman and compete with Frey to play the Nickel

 

6R- Best OT available- Another Kromer project here, perhaps put him in the Britton role (Where was that today BTW)

 

6R- Tallest TE available- Give McCown or McCarron yet another monster red zone target ala Joesph Fauria.

 

I know a lot of people will get on me for drafting 4 offensive players but when you consider the defense will be adding Melton, Collins, Tillman, Williams, Bennett, Byrd, Hageman, the 3R safety, and really, a healthy Briggs to what we have seen in recent weeks that defense looks wayyyy different.

['TD']

Honestly, I think Mel Tucker is the key on what they do on defense next year. If they give him a bye, due to injuries, then he will probably have the chance to move away from the Lovie two.

 

The defense was a major fail this year and I can;t think of a team that ran a solid cover 2 defense this year. The that has had the most success with it in the NFL has put up historically one of the worst defenses in NFL history.

 

I think the defensive strategy will change next year due to the failure this year, and the massive change over due to happen with the roster, even if tucker is retained.

[scs787]

What type of D does Carolina and Seattle play?? They both run 4-3s. I can honestly say I'm ignorant to the different variations of 4-3s or 3-4s, I know them as just that 4-3s and 3-4s.

 

Not against a 3-4 though....Not sure if Tillman has the speed to play man to man so they might have to either shift him to safety or if he doesn't wanna do that then move on from him. Jennings is a burner though and I think he can stick. Maybe replace Hageman with Denard in the first then get a monster like DaQuan Jones in the 3rd to play NT, or use the 5M I gave Bennett(doesn't fit in a 3-4) to get a NT or man to man corner.

[Stinger226]

I'm still not sold that they will move on from Jay, for better or for worse, but just to get the loss off my mind for a little bit, lets say Jay is let go and they give Josh like 3M to compete with a rookie here is what my ideal offseason would look like....

 

Bears will have the 4th most cap room of any team in the league, and with a Championship caliber offense, Chicago should be an inviting place for FAs to sign. Assuming they cut Peppers they will have 50M in cap space.

 

Resign

 

Tillman 5M

Jennings 5M

Melton 3M prove it deal

Collins 1M

Ratliff 1M

Wootton 3M

Bowman 2M

Williams 1.5M

Slausson 2M

Gould 4.5M

McCown 3M

 

 

Total 31M

 

Sign

 

Michael Bennett 5M

Jarius Byrd 8M

 

Total 13M

Grand Total 44M

 

Don't know how much cap you need for the draft but 6M should be enough,and then there are other moves that can be made to make room to fill out the roster.

Draft

 

1R- Ra'Shede Hageman DT Minny- I've been a big supporter of Paea over the years, but I think the DL can use more girth vs Paea's strength. With his big body and freakishly long arms I think he'd help the run defense big time.

 

2R- A.J. McCarron QB Bama- Or really whatever QB Trestman likes the most, with the plethora of depth at the QB position in the draft there's bound to be someone who slips to the Bears in the 2R. I've been against McCarron in the past, calling him a product of the system, but thinking about it, what we have here is indeed a system. Our receivers are so big and almost always out match the opposing DBs, so it's just like what he sees at Bama. There may be better options that drop but if not I'm cool with A.J..

 

3R- Best safety available- I'm ready to give COnte and Wright the boot.

 

4R- Best center available- Ready to move on from Garza and let Kromer work his magic.

 

5R- Best CB available- A prospect to groom behind Tillman/Jennings/Bowman and compete with Frey to play the Nickel

 

6R- Best OT available- Another Kromer project here, perhaps put him in the Britton role (Where was that today BTW)

 

6R- Tallest TE available- Give McCown or McCarron yet another monster red zone target ala Joesph Fauria.

 

I know a lot of people will get on me for drafting 4 offensive players but when you consider the defense will be adding Melton, Collins, Tillman, Williams, Bennett, Byrd, Hageman, the 3R safety, and really, a healthy Briggs to what we have seen in recent weeks that defense looks wayyyy different.

The math doesnt work on you proposal. We have 28 players still under contract, you added 13 and with 6 rookies that is 47 players. Your additions takes all of our cap space so how do add 6 players with no money? We have to get the players you listed for probably about 6 mil less than you stated and then you need to leave around 3 to 4 mil to sign players thru the year, so your math is off by around 10 mil.

[Uncle Buck]

Honestly, I think Mel Tucker is the key on what they do on defense next year. If they give him a bye, due to injuries, then he will probably have the chance to move away from the Lovie two.

 

The defense was a major fail this year and I can;t think of a team that ran a solid cover 2 defense this year. The that has had the most success with it in the NFL has put up historically one of the worst defenses in NFL history.

 

I think the defensive strategy will change next year due to the failure this year, and the massive change over due to happen with the roster, even if tucker is retained.

 

 

I think the defensive strategy for this year was interesting. I would bet all new coaching regimes bring in new systems. We did it here on offense and it worked just fine. I don't know why Mel could not have done it on defense. I think changing it should have been to Tucker's version of the 4-3, since a 3-4 has not been the style he has coached. It was a interesting nod to the veterans on this team, but it was a gamble that lost. I know all about the injuries, and there is validity there, but to be this bad just can't be hung on players being hurt. Another thing, how bad must Washington be to be drafted and never played in this god awful mess. He could not take any playing time from SMC?

[bowlingtwig]

I think the defensive strategy for this year was interesting. I would bet all new coaching regimes bring in new systems. We did it here on offense and it worked just fine. I don't know why Mel could not have done it on defense. I think changing it should have been to Tucker's version of the 4-3, since a 3-4 has not been the style he has coached. It was a interesting nod to the veterans on this team, but it was a gamble that lost. I know all about the injuries, and there is validity there, but to be this bad just can't be hung on players being hurt. Another thing, how bad must Washington be to be drafted and never played in this god awful mess. He could not take any playing time from SMC?

Actually we could technically switch to the 3-4. Mel has coached both systems in past. I am in favor of ditching the cover 2 in favor of a more attacking style defense

[GakMan23]

Nice thing about if they did resign Ratliff is he played NT in a 3/4 in Dallas (probowler) and has shown flashes of his former probowl self in this god awful system. I would like to see him resigned as well.

[bowlingtwig]

Nice thing about if they did resign Ratliff is he played NT in a 3/4 in Dallas (probowler) and has shown flashes of his former probowl self in this god awful system. I would like to see him resigned as well.

Exactly. I just can't see him coming back for just $1M like SCS has in his scenario

[scs787]

The math doesnt work on you proposal. We have 28 players still under contract, you added 13 and with 6 rookies that is 47 players. Your additions takes all of our cap space so how do add 6 players with no money? We have to get the players you listed for probably about 6 mil less than you stated and then you need to leave around 3 to 4 mil to sign players thru the year, so your math is off by around 10 mil.

 

 

How much money is needed for the draft? Remember there is apparently some way to add players who don't count against the cap, I believe Emery did this last offseason. Some of the contracts I alluded to can be back loaded where it opens up a few more mill for other players, there could be some cap causalities on the current roster to open up even more.

 

 

Twig, as far as Ratliff goes, I'm not sure he gets much more than a mill, maybe 2.5 tops. He's shown some flashes in the Browns game but he didn't back that up yesterday. I think he still takes a 1 year "prove it contract".

[BearFan2000]

Honestly, I think Mel Tucker is the key on what they do on defense next year. If they give him a bye, due to injuries, then he will probably have the chance to move away from the Lovie two.

 

The defense was a major fail this year and I can;t think of a team that ran a solid cover 2 defense this year. The that has had the most success with it in the NFL has put up historically one of the worst defenses in NFL history.

 

I think the defensive strategy will change next year due to the failure this year, and the massive change over due to happen with the roster, even if tucker is retained.

 

I think it has to change. Forget tying to cater a system to what the guys are used to. While at the time the reasoning may have made sense as the D was our strong suit the past 5-10 years. But the Tampa 2 that Lovie Ran only works when you have two key ingredients. pressure from your front 7, and turnovers. We are getting almost no pressure at all, allowing QB's to have all day to throw, which exposes our poor secondary coverage so teams can light us up in the pass game, we play undisciplined in our run D and so we get lit up by anyone coming out of the backfield carrying the ball even guys who were on some teams practice squad the week before. It's time for a change whether it's Tucker back next year and he puts in a different system, or we bring in someone else to run their system. We didn't change our system from last year because "if it aint broke don't fix it" well it's pretty damn broken and needs to be fixed. This will be the key to any future success. When you can't stop anyone on d you give up points like we did today, and it puts all the pressure on your offense to "keep up" when the opposition knows they've made you one dimensional. With the offense developing into a better scoring offense, we don't need a spectacular D we just need a good D.

[Stinger226]

How much money is needed for the draft? Remember there is apparently some way to add players who don't count against the cap, I believe Emery did this last offseason. Some of the contracts I alluded to can be back loaded where it opens up a few more mill for other players, there could be some cap causalities on the current roster to open up even more.

 

 

Twig, as far as Ratliff goes, I'm not sure he gets much more than a mill, maybe 2.5 tops. He's shown some flashes in the Browns game but he didn't back that up yesterday. I think he still takes a 1 year "prove it contract".

When you sign players at a vet min. for example McCown makes 840 thou but it only counts as 600 against the cap. I am not sure of the excursion but it works something like that. I suspect that some of the players wont play for what you suggest on the resign list. There is no way Melton will come here and play for 3 mil. He wouldnt go will a long term deal when they were paying him 8 mil. I see McCown coming back for 1.5 and more if we dont resign Cutler. Ratliff is making 1 mil. now if will take more to bring him back, he has shown so signs of being a better player.Most of your proposal looks good, but think some of the math wont work as far as the salary.

[Bears4Ever_34]

If they decide to move on from Cutler, I would love to see them give up a 4th rounder for Terrel Pryor. He is an amazing talent, and I could see Trestman turning him into a superstar.

 

I'm also on board with drafting the kid out of Alabama. He's a very mechanical quarterback that understands how to read defenses and has played in a pro system for 4 years.

[Stinger226]

If they decide to move on from Cutler, I would love to see them give up a 4th rounder for Terrel Pryor. He is an amazing talent, and I could see Trestman turning him into a superstar.

 

I'm also on board with drafting the kid out of Alabama. He's a very mechanical quarterback that understands how to read defenses and has played in a pro system for 4 years.

I suspect Pryor wont be all that good, but we will see. I do like McCareron.

[AZ54]

I think it has to change. Forget tying to cater a system to what the guys are used to. While at the time the reasoning may have made sense as the D was our strong suit the past 5-10 years. But the Tampa 2 that Lovie Ran only works when you have two key ingredients. pressure from your front 7, and turnovers. We are getting almost no pressure at all, allowing QB's to have all day to throw, which exposes our poor secondary coverage so teams can light us up in the pass game, we play undisciplined in our run D and so we get lit up by anyone coming out of the backfield carrying the ball even guys who were on some teams practice squad the week before. It's time for a change whether it's Tucker back next year and he puts in a different system, or we bring in someone else to run their system. We didn't change our system from last year because "if it aint broke don't fix it" well it's pretty damn broken and needs to be fixed. This will be the key to any future success. When you can't stop anyone on d you give up points like we did today, and it puts all the pressure on your offense to "keep up" when the opposition knows they've made you one dimensional. With the offense developing into a better scoring offense, we don't need a spectacular D we just need a good D.

 

Well said. Not sure if it was Tucker, Trestman, or Emery who decided to continue with the Lovie 2 because of our veterans. Likely it was all 3 on board with the decision, and I did not disagree with it. We got burned by injuries and age and so the gamble failed. Tucker may have been technically able to coordinate that D but he was not a disciple of it and so can't be expected to teach the nuances as well as a coach with years of experience in it. We gambled on our defensive veterans and it didn't work out.

 

As soon as our season is done Trestman needs to decide on what defense we're going to run. Tucker is not the right coordinator to run Lovie's D. Then what is Tucker's preferred defense? Don't know, but if he's not the right man for the D Trestman wants to run let's move on. I don't care if we go 4-3 or 3-4, one-gap or two-gap. Either can be successful just get the right talent and the right coordinator to run it. Some 3-4 defenses use cover 2, some use man on the corners. I don't so much care about the backend as I believe it all starts up front and there is where we are getting killed on D.

 

Contracts forced Emery's hand on this because he couldn't commit to long term new deals, or at least he stayed away from it by avoiding restructuring aside from Peppers. Regardless, we are set up for a major transformation on D this offseason let's get after it.

[Lucky Luciano]

Well said. Not sure if it was Tucker, Trestman, or Emery who decided to continue with the Lovie 2 because of our veterans. Likely it was all 3 on board with the decision, and I did not disagree with it. We got burned by injuries and age and so the gamble failed. Tucker may have been technically able to coordinate that D but he was not a disciple of it and so can't be expected to teach the nuances as well as a coach with years of experience in it. We gambled on our defensive veterans and it didn't work out.

 

As soon as our season is done Trestman needs to decide on what defense we're going to run. Tucker is not the right coordinator to run Lovie's D. Then what is Tucker's preferred defense? Don't know, but if he's not the right man for the D Trestman wants to run let's move on. I don't care if we go 4-3 or 3-4, one-gap or two-gap. Either can be successful just get the right talent and the right coordinator to run it. Some 3-4 defenses use cover 2, some use man on the corners. I don't so much care about the backend as I believe it all starts up front and there is where we are getting killed on D.

the great mel tucker and all of his accomplishments

 

2008 browns DC - with defensive minded coach romeo crennel the browns ran a 3-4 defense. this was the first year as a coordinator - overall rank for pts. = 16th; total yds given up = 26th;

 

passing: ranked 14th for passing yds; 10th for passing td's allowed; net yards gained per pass attempt = 29th

rushing: totaly yds = 28th; rushing td's = 21; yds per attempt = 25th

 

2009 jaguars DC - with del rio a defensive minded HC ran a 4-3. overall rank for pts = 24th; total yds given up = 23rd

 

passing: ranked 26th for td's given up; ranked 27th in yds gained; ranked 30th for net yds gained per attempt

rushing: total yds 19th; td's 14th; rushing yds per attempt 12th

 

2010 jags DC - pts allowed 27th; yds allowed 28th

 

passing: ranked 28th yds allowed; ranked 26th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 22nd yds allowed; 29th for td's allowed

 

2011 jags DC and interim HC for last 5 games - pts allowed 11th; yds allowed ranked 6th

 

passing: ranked 8th yds allowed; ranked 9th for td's

rushing: ranked 9th yds allowed; ranked 20th for td's allowed

 

2012 jags DC assistant HC under an OFFENSIVE minded head coach (mularkey) - [[ ranked 29th for pts allowed ]] - [[ ranked 30th for yds allowed ]]

 

passing: ranked 22nd yds allowed; ranked 12th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 30th for yds allowed; ranked 31st for td's allowed

 

and we hired this guy WHY???

 

2013 chicago bears DC after 15 games - ranked 30th for points allowed; ranked 29th for yds allowed

 

passing: ranked 14 total yds; ranked 14th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 32 yds allowed; 31 for td's allowed

 

we passed on rob ryan for this guy? and people want to give this guy another year to do exactly what??

[jason]

the great mel tucker and all of his accomplishments

 

2008 browns DC - with defensive minded coach romeo crennel the browns ran a 3-4 defense. this was the first year as a coordinator - overall rank for pts. = 16th; total yds given up = 26th;

 

passing: ranked 14th for passing yds; 10th for passing td's allowed; net yards gained per pass attempt = 29th

rushing: totaly yds = 28th; rushing td's = 21; yds per attempt = 25th

 

2009 jaguars DC - with del rio a defensive minded HC ran a 4-3. overall rank for pts = 24th; total yds given up = 23rd

 

passing: ranked 26th for td's given up; ranked 27th in yds gained; ranked 30th for net yds gained per attempt

rushing: total yds 19th; td's 14th; rushing yds per attempt 12th

 

2010 jags DC - pts allowed 27th; yds allowed 28th

 

passing: ranked 28th yds allowed; ranked 26th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 22nd yds allowed; 29th for td's allowed

 

2011 jags DC and interim HC for last 5 games - pts allowed 11th; yds allowed ranked 6th

 

passing: ranked 8th yds allowed; ranked 9th for td's

rushing: ranked 9th yds allowed; ranked 20th for td's allowed

 

2012 jags DC assistant HC under an OFFENSIVE minded head coach (mularkey) - [[ ranked 29th for pts allowed ]] - [[ ranked 30th for yds allowed ]]

 

passing: ranked 22nd yds allowed; ranked 12th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 30th for yds allowed; ranked 31st for td's allowed

 

and we hired this guy WHY???

 

2013 chicago bears DC after 15 games - ranked 30th for points allowed; ranked 29th for yds allowed

 

passing: ranked 14 total yds; ranked 14th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 32 yds allowed; 31 for td's allowed

 

we passed on rob ryan for this guy? and people want to give this guy another year to do exactly what??

 

DAMN GOOD post.

 

[scs787]

My thinking behind the logic of hiring Tucker is with a team that returned 9 of its 11 starters they wanted to sign someone who was going to keep everything as close to the same as possible in a sort of "if it aint broke don't fix it kinda way". Mel obviously offered that with his willingness to even keep the same terminology....Just my hunch, and if true, it's not a bad thought process.....Just hasn't worked out

[jason]

the great mel tucker and all of his accomplishments

 

2008 browns DC - with defensive minded coach romeo crennel the browns ran a 3-4 defense. this was the first year as a coordinator - overall rank for pts. = 16th; total yds given up = 26th;

 

passing: ranked 14th for passing yds; 10th for passing td's allowed; net yards gained per pass attempt = 29th

rushing: totaly yds = 28th; rushing td's = 21; yds per attempt = 25th

 

2009 jaguars DC - with del rio a defensive minded HC ran a 4-3. overall rank for pts = 24th; total yds given up = 23rd

 

passing: ranked 26th for td's given up; ranked 27th in yds gained; ranked 30th for net yds gained per attempt

rushing: total yds 19th; td's 14th; rushing yds per attempt 12th

 

2010 jags DC - pts allowed 27th; yds allowed 28th

 

passing: ranked 28th yds allowed; ranked 26th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 22nd yds allowed; 29th for td's allowed

 

2011 jags DC and interim HC for last 5 games - pts allowed 11th; yds allowed ranked 6th

 

passing: ranked 8th yds allowed; ranked 9th for td's

rushing: ranked 9th yds allowed; ranked 20th for td's allowed

 

2012 jags DC assistant HC under an OFFENSIVE minded head coach (mularkey) - [[ ranked 29th for pts allowed ]] - [[ ranked 30th for yds allowed ]]

 

passing: ranked 22nd yds allowed; ranked 12th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 30th for yds allowed; ranked 31st for td's allowed

 

and we hired this guy WHY???

 

2013 chicago bears DC after 15 games - ranked 30th for points allowed; ranked 29th for yds allowed

 

passing: ranked 14 total yds; ranked 14th for td's allowed

rushing: ranked 32 yds allowed; 31 for td's allowed

 

we passed on rob ryan for this guy? and people want to give this guy another year to do exactly what??

 

I'll reiterate.

 

DAMN GOOD post.

 

Why was he hired in the first place? Where is his resume of success? He has done nothing but fail since he has been in the NFL. Why perpetuate it? If Rob Ryan is even remotely interested, you dump Tucker in a heartbeat.