Here is a point worth thinking about

[Stinger226]

This is an article that suggests what Emery might do in the draft. His traits he looks for. I think Hageman also fits that mold.

http://nflmocks.com/2014/03/29/chicago-bea...icks-nfl-draft/

[Mongo3451]

I would not be disappointed with the Justin Gilbert pick. IMO- CB is always the more important pick over safety. There are arguments to support both, but. Good CB play hides bad safety play more than the inverse. Plus, with Gilbert's size and athleticism, failure at CB may lead to a good safety. That doesn't work the other way around.

[bradjock]

This is an article that suggests what Emery might do in the draft. His traits he looks for. I think Hageman also fits that mold.

http://nflmocks.com/2014/03/29/chicago-bea...icks-nfl-draft/

 

That is interesting. I'd add that most were shocked that we seemed to significantly reach for Shea, Kyle Long, and Jon Bostic. Shea and Long were projected to go in the 2nd or 3rd round and Bostic 4th or 5th. Confirming what the article said, we drafted an undersized guy in Shea, and Emery said he would think twice about doing that again.

 

In two years Ermery has drafted, we've been surprised and he took guys who were not on our radar. We've mostly discussed the players the article mentions. Ebron, Mosely, Ha Ha, and Gilbert. The one interesting guy is Stephon Tuitt. He's fast and tall. Could we covet him over Donald & Jerrigan?

[Stinger226]

That is interesting. I'd add that most were shocked that we seemed to significantly reach for Shea, Kyle Long, and Jon Bostic. Shea and Long were projected to go in the 2nd or 3rd round and Bostic 4th or 5th. Confirming what the article said, we drafted an undersized guy in Shea, and Emery said he would think twice about doing that again.

 

In two years Ermery has drafted, we've been surprised and he took guys who were not on our radar. We've mostly discussed the players the article mentions. Ebron, Mosely, Ha Ha, and Gilbert. The one interesting guy is Stephon Tuitt. He's fast and tall. Could we covet him over Donald & Jerrigan?

I think Truitt and Hageman fit that big long athletic players he covets. I think Donald would be a good choice but think Emery will surprise us probably by moving down and grabbing one of those two.

[AZ54]

Regarding Shea…Emery said he wouldn't consider the undersized guy for DE again as he did with SMC. He has said as much before in that undersized guys need to have elite athletic ability to overcome the gap. SMC is not elite but he is a good athlete.

 

I have not said so yet, but Tuitt's ability has always intrigued me based on the initial draft profiles I read in January. In some ways I've been surprised by the fact he seems to have fallen off the radar down toward the 2nd Rd. He seemed like a perfect fit for what Emery wants on our Dline now in terms of versatility. I understand the injury affected him during the season but I think he'd have been rising instead of falling as the draft workouts progressed if he were in shape now.

 

Back to what I said about SMC above: Emery feels undersized players need to be elite athletes if he's going to pick them. Aaron Donald is an elite athlete for the DT position. He'd be a DE if he had the length for the position otherwise his stats match up with the best DEs. He also has the character Emery wants. He belongs on that list.

 

 

[Stinger226]

Regarding Shea…Emery said he wouldn't consider the undersized guy for DE again as he did with SMC. He has said as much before in that undersized guys need to have elite athletic ability to overcome the gap. SMC is not elite but he is a good athlete.

 

I have not said so yet, but Tuitt's ability has always intrigued me based on the initial draft profiles I read in January. In some ways I've been surprised by the fact he seems to have fallen off the radar down toward the 2nd Rd. He seemed like a perfect fit for what Emery wants on our Dline now in terms of versatility. I understand the injury affected him during the season but I think he'd have been rising instead of falling as the draft workouts progressed if he were in shape now.

 

Back to what I said about SMC above: Emery feels undersized players need to be elite athletes if he's going to pick them. Aaron Donald is an elite athlete for the DT position. He'd be a DE if he had the length for the position otherwise his stats match up with the best DEs. He also has the character Emery wants. He belongs on that list.

He doesnt have the length but think the rest applies to him. Everybody thinks we will draft him if available, of which I would want but me think Emery will have a surprise for us. Maybe the surprise this time is -he takes who we thing he will draft.

[scs787]

Regarding Shea…Emery said he wouldn't consider the undersized guy for DE again as he did with SMC. He has said as much before in that undersized guys need to have elite athletic ability to overcome the gap. SMC is not elite but he is a good athlete.

 

I have not said so yet, but Tuitt's ability has always intrigued me based on the initial draft profiles I read in January. In some ways I've been surprised by the fact he seems to have fallen off the radar down toward the 2nd Rd. He seemed like a perfect fit for what Emery wants on our Dline now in terms of versatility. I understand the injury affected him during the season but I think he'd have been rising instead of falling as the draft workouts progressed if he were in shape now.

 

Back to what I said about SMC above: Emery feels undersized players need to be elite athletes if he's going to pick them. Aaron Donald is an elite athlete for the DT position. He'd be a DE if he had the length for the position otherwise his stats match up with the best DEs. He also has the character Emery wants. He belongs on that list.

 

The problem with Tuitt is that he wasn't to go through those said workouts neither at the combine or his pro day. Couple that with a subpar 2013 season and you're really just hoping he returns to his 2012 form..... He and Hageman, who also didn't really have a great 2013 season are guys who will be drafted on their potential. Both guys are really intriguing and I wouldn't hate either.

 

But ya I agree that Donald is an elite athlete, and he's still the guy I want. Dude has supposedly been running 4.5s in training for his pro day. You said he'd be a DE if he had length, hell he could probably be a LB if he had some cover skills. He ran a faster 3 cone drill than Mosely did 7.11 vs 7.30 and if he does run a 4.5 at his pro day it will be quicker than Moselys as well(4.63).

 

I don't think there's enough to go off of to say Phil would prefer Tuitt/Hageman vs Donald/Jernigan. In fact he was the director of scouting in KC when they drafted the 6'1" 290 pound Glenn Dorsey with the 5th overall pic, and hes brought in/brought back the 6'2" Nate collins.

[bradjock]

The problem with Tuitt is that he wasn't to go through those said workouts neither at the combine or his pro day. Couple that with a subpar 2013 season and you're really just hoping he returns to his 2012 form..... He and Hageman, who also didn't really have a great 2013 season are guys who will be drafted on their potential. Both guys are really intriguing and I wouldn't hate either.

 

But ya I agree that Donald is an elite athlete, and he's still the guy I want. Dude has supposedly been running 4.5s in training for his pro day. You said he'd be a DE if he had length, hell he could probably be a LB if he had some cover skills. He ran a faster 3 cone drill than Mosely did 7.11 vs 7.30 and if he does run a 4.5 at his pro day it will be quicker than Moselys as well(4.63).

 

I don't think there's enough to go off of to say Phil would prefer Tuitt/Hageman vs Donald/Jernigan. In fact he was the director of scouting in KC when they drafted the 6'1" 290 pound Glenn Dorsey with the 5th overall pic, and hes brought in/brought back the 6'2" Nate collins.

 

With Tuitt, on one hand, I don't think Emery has a problem drafting a guy based on potential, as we saw with Kyle Long. But it may change things that we are drafting 14th in a draft that's loaded. Not 19th or 20th in a weaker drafter.

 

With Glenn Dorsey, aside from injury concerns, he was a monster coming out of college and a no-brainer to go at #5. Granted, he never emerged. But he was a guy with the productivity and an elite athlete.

 

With most of these guys we are talking about, I'm guessing they are all going to have a very similar/close grade. When that's the case, that means we draft for need. Assuming Houston stays mostly at DE, DT is by far our greatest need. You could argue safety, but if our DT's suck, they won't stand a chance. Does anyone feel that Nate Collins or Jay Ratliff can stay healthy and productive for an entire season? Did Paea do anything last year other than prove he's a nice back-up?

[CrackerDog]

I think Truitt and Hageman fit that big long athletic players he covets. I think Donald would be a good choice but think Emery will surprise us probably by moving down and grabbing one of those two.

 

Problem is history shows he doesn't trade down for his reaches. He could likely get "his guy" and get something else to sweeten the pot. Long being the only exception to this as he'd have been gone before any later pick we may have gotten. This seems to be Emery's major "flaw".

[scs787]

Problem is history shows he doesn't trade down for his reaches. He could likely get "his guy" and get something else to sweeten the pot. Long being the only exception to this as he'd have been gone before any later pick we may have gotten. This seems to be Emery's major "flaw".

 

People tend to forget that SMC was, depending where you look, ranked anywhere between 22-31, and I believe both New England and Green Bay said he was gonna be their pick. The problem with the pick was that he was projected that high as OLB, not a DE.

 

So did he reach? Ya, a little bit, but I wouldn't call what he's done a major "flaw".

[Stinger226]

People tend to forget that SMC was, depending where you look, ranked anywhere between 22-31, and I believe both New England and Green Bay said he was gonna be their pick. The problem with the pick was that he was projected that high as OLB, not a DE.

 

So did he reach? Ya, a little bit, but I wouldn't call what he's done a major "flaw".

This is the third year and hopefully he becomes a productive player, if not, so far Emery has hit one and missed one. I like the other things he has done. Jeffery is a stud, I think Bostic will be a very good player, but what he has done in FAgency has been quite amazing IMO. He sees what we see and goes out and addresses it. Time will tell if he was right on all of this but he definitely needs to hit on at least 3 picks this year but of course we may not know that until a few years from now.

[bradjock]

Problem is history shows he doesn't trade down for his reaches. He could likely get "his guy" and get something else to sweeten the pot. Long being the only exception to this as he'd have been gone before any later pick we may have gotten. This seems to be Emery's major "flaw".

 

Maybe, but that's speculation. For example, for this draft currently the experts are saying that most teams want to trade down but it's not possible. The Bears would have to have a partner and get decent value. Are we really able to trade down and would a similar player we want be available?

 

With Shea, supposedly the Patriots were going to take him at #25 (They took ILB Dont'a Hightower) and the Packers wanted him at #28 (they took DE Nick Perry). Of course the Bears wanted Melvin Ingram who went #18 to San Diego.

 

With Kyle Long, we thought so highly of him that we thought he was a steal at #20 . . .

 

On hindsight, Shea may have been a bad pick and Kyle Long may be our eventual starting tackle who was a steal. It's early and we're looking at revisionist history. Every GM will say they were thrilled that the player they drafted was available.

 

 

 

 

[bradjock]

Problem is history shows he doesn't trade down for his reaches. He could likely get "his guy" and get something else to sweeten the pot. Long being the only exception to this as he'd have been gone before any later pick we may have gotten. This seems to be Emery's major "flaw".

 

How about this for an Emery trade steal: Last year, the Bears traded the #153 pick to Atlanta. Atlanta traded up so they could take DE Stansly Maponga who played in 5 games last season recording a total of 5 tackles.

 

In the trade the Bears received picks #163 and #236. We took Jordan Mills at #163 and Marquis Wilson at #236. Mills started every game last season at RT helping solidify the offensive line. Wilson has tons of potential and will likely be our #3 WR this year. That's awesome.

 

I'd add on how damn tricky trades are: Last year Miami traded up from #12 to #3. All Oakland received was Miami's #12 pick and their 2nd round pick #46. Then Miami takes Dion Jordan and most mocks had Jordan going in the #12 range to begin with. So Miami got a steal from Oakland, traded up, and then reached for a player . . .

 

 

[bradjock]

Problem is history shows he doesn't trade down for his reaches. He could likely get "his guy" and get something else to sweeten the pot. Long being the only exception to this as he'd have been gone before any later pick we may have gotten. This seems to be Emery's major "flaw".

 

How about this for an Emery trade steal: Last year, the Bears traded the #153 pick to Atlanta. Atlanta traded up so they could take DE Stansly Maponga who played in 5 games last season recording a total of 5 tackles.

 

In the trade the Bears received picks #163 and #236. We took Jordan Mills at #163 and Marquis Wilson at #236. Mills started every game last season at RT helping solidify the offensive line. Wilson has tons of potential and will likely be our #3 WR this year. That's awesome.

 

I'd add on how damn tricky trades are: Last year Miami traded up from #12 to #3. All Oakland received was Miami's #12 pick and their 2nd round pick #46. Then Miami takes Dion Jordan and most mocks had Jordan going in the #12 range to begin with. So Miami got a steal from Oakland, traded up, and then reached for a player . . .

 

 

[Guest TerraTor]

Regarding Shea…Emery said he wouldn't consider the undersized guy for DE again as he did with SMC. He has said as much before in that undersized guys need to have elite athletic ability to overcome the gap. SMC is not elite but he is a good athlete.

 

I have not said so yet, but Tuitt's ability has always intrigued me based on the initial draft profiles I read in January. In some ways I've been surprised by the fact he seems to have fallen off the radar down toward the 2nd Rd. He seemed like a perfect fit for what Emery wants on our Dline now in terms of versatility. I understand the injury affected him during the season but I think he'd have been rising instead of falling as the draft workouts progressed if he were in shape now.

 

Back to what I said about SMC above: Emery feels undersized players need to be elite athletes if he's going to pick them. Aaron Donald is an elite athlete for the DT position. He'd be a DE if he had the length for the position otherwise his stats match up with the best DEs. He also has the character Emery wants. He belongs on that list.

 

 

my opinion, Emery didnt make the pick... Nor did he have a say. Lovie made it.. He has lovie written all over him

[bradjock]

my opinion, Emery didnt make the pick... Nor did he have a say. Lovie made it.. He has lovie written all over him

 

I agree Emery was responding to Lovie's input. As good as our defense was and as bad as our offense was . . . OT Riley Reiff falls to us at #19 and we pass on him to reach for an undersized DE. That's Lovie. Good luck Tampa. Although, ultimately, Emery's name is attached to the pick. That being said, Emery didn't hesitate to fire Lovie the next offseason.

[scs787]

Maybe, Lovie had some insight, but Phil sure didn't do anything last year(post Lovie) to give SMC any less of a role...He did quite the opposite actually by letting Izzy go and making SMC our #3 DE and not really putting shit behind him. You'd think if Phil didn't like/support the pick he would have, at the very least, gave him some competition for the job.

[Stinger226]

my opinion, Emery didnt make the pick... Nor did he have a say. Lovie made it.. He has lovie written all over him

Spot on with that call.

[Stinger226]

Maybe, Lovie had some insight, but Phil sure didn't do anything last year(post Lovie) to give SMC any less of a role...He did quite the opposite actually by letting Izzy go and making SMC our #3 DE and not really putting shit behind him. You'd think if Phil didn't like/support the pick he would have, at the very least, gave him some competition for the job.

There are a lot of players who dont play well there first year, so I understand his support for his first round pick. The facts will come to light this year. He will be a bust as a 1st round pick, he missed on that one.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

Spot on with that call.

No 1st year GM is going to lead his head coach, who he inherited, no less, make the 1st round pick on his own.

[Chitownhustla]

Maybe, Lovie had some insight, but Phil sure didn't do anything last year(post Lovie) to give SMC any less of a role...He did quite the opposite actually by letting Izzy go and making SMC our #3 DE and not really putting shit behind him. You'd think if Phil didn't like/support the pick he would have, at the very least, gave him some competition for the job.

 

 

I tend to lean towards the pick was more of a Lovie Pick. Giving Shea a chance to play this past year had to happen. He was a first round pick, there are plenty of guys with his size and speed that have been good to great at DE. They gave him a shot and it didn't turn out so they are moving him to OLB.

 

 

I still think with some added strength he could have turned out ok at DE. Hopefully this move is a good move as I don't want another first round bust.

 

 

 

[madlithuanian]

I tend to agree.

 

It happens. Even great franchises with history of great picks bust on a 1st round player.

 

This season will be telling. Either he is a solid contributor as a LB/rusher or he is not. If he is, then the bust is tempered by the fact that he can contribute. If not, then he's a bust straight up.

 

I tend to lean towards the pick was more of a Lovie Pick. Giving Shea a chance to play this past year had to happen. He was a first round pick, there are plenty of guys with his size and speed that have been good to great at DE. They gave him a shot and it didn't turn out so they are moving him to OLB.

 

 

I still think with some added strength he could have turned out ok at DE. Hopefully this move is a good move as I don't want another first round bust.

 

[jason]

Maybe, but that's speculation. For example, for this draft currently the experts are saying that most teams want to trade down but it's not possible. The Bears would have to have a partner and get decent value. Are we really able to trade down and would a similar player we want be available?

 

With Shea, supposedly the Patriots were going to take him at #25 (They took ILB Dont'a Hightower) and the Packers wanted him at #28 (they took DE Nick Perry). Of course the Bears wanted Melvin Ingram who went #18 to San Diego.

 

With Kyle Long, we thought so highly of him that we thought he was a steal at #20 . . .

 

On hindsight, Shea may have been a bad pick and Kyle Long may be our eventual starting tackle who was a steal. It's early and we're looking at revisionist history. Every GM will say they were thrilled that the player they drafted was available.

 

Is it revisionist history if just about everyone on the board didn't like the Shea pick? I can't find the draft thread, but here's Bears4Ever_34 calling the Shae move back to LB.